Hi!
Hey!
You sound so sweet!
Thank you.
Are you
nervous about talking to me?
Yeah.
So, you
know we gotta...
be, like...
really careful
about doing this.
Yeah.
Yeah?
What are you thinkin'?
What
are you thinkin'?
I'm thinkin'
I wish I was there with you
right now.
If I
was, you'd be naked.
Really?
Yeah!
Would you wanna be?
I guess so.
Okay!
My precious little princess.
I like it
when you call me that.
I like
calling you that.
I've thought
about you all day.
I have to go to Walmart
really quick, though.
Get them things so I
don't get you pregnant.
Okay.
And then,
I'm gonna be on my way.
Did you finish
painting your toenails?
Yup,
they're all nice and pink.
Okay.
I gotta go!
I'll see ya in a few?
Why are you rushing?
I don't know,
I'm kinda nervous.
Well,
don't be nervous!
I am a very lucky guy.
You think so?
Hey!
I'm glad you could come!
Hey, girl!
How are you?
I'm good, how are you?
Good!
How was your drive?
Uh...
- terrible.
- Really?! How come?
No, actually, it was all right.
Oh?
Well, look, we got
these new chairs.
You have to sit down!
Okay, I have to sit down?
Yeah, look.
- It's a massager chair.
- Oh my God, look at that!
It vibrates when you
press the buttons.
Oh my God...
Yeah, flip the switches.
Which one is it?
Um, you can use
either one of them.
It tells you...
There's one for your butt,
there's one for your lower
back, and there's one
for your upper back.
I just felt my butt...
I think...
You can pretty much tell the
difference when you press
- all of them.
- Holy--!
- Yup, that's my butt.
- It feels so good, right?!
I thought you had blonde hair!
Do you like it?
I dyed it by myself.
- I think it's pretty.
- Thank you!
It's very pretty!
I haven't had a kiss yet.
Oh, okay.
Well, then what
did you wanna do?
Well, I want a kiss first.
And then what?
Can I have a kiss first?
- Well, let's talk first!
- Okay!
You just got here!
Would you like me to go in
the truck and get my stuff?
No, it's all right.
No? You don't want
your thing right now?
The present I gave ya?
Well, what is it?
Well, I can't tell you.
That wouldn't be much of
a present if I told you.
Well, you can go get it in
a little bit or something,
- okay?
- Okay.
All right.
Are you nervous?
- A little bit.
- A little bit?
Not as bad as what you
thought you would be?
Not as bad, but I
still am kinda nervous.
I'd rather, like,
talk a little bit first,
and then, like-- so I'm
more comfortable, you know?
That's, like, cool.
Good.
I'm really glad.
I like seeing you in person.
Yeah, I like seeing you too.
Good.
- So...
- This is getting hot. How come?
Oh, because press
the red button.
- It's a heater too.
- Oh.
You gonna have a seat too?
I actually-- I like to
sit on the edge of chairs.
- Do ya?
- Yeah.
You seem
pretty comfortable there.
- How are you, sir?
- How are you?
- All right, how are you doin'?
- What's happenin'?
- Not too much.
- Not too much?
You a Boston fan?
Actually, I don't
even watch baseball.
Oh.
But it's a Boston cap.
- It's a Boston cap, yeah.
- Yeah.
So, what are you up to tonight?
Not a whole lot.
- Not a whole lot?
- No.
Well, I'll tell
ya, for the last...
several days,
you've been up to a lot.
You're a pretty
prolific chatter there.
Wanna explain yourself?
Not really, I never...
really...
was gonna do anything.
You weren't really
going to do anything?
No.
So, you brought condoms...
What else did you bring?
- I brought her a bracelet.
- A bracelet.
And her...
And she is how old?
- Supposed to be 13.
- Supposed to be 13.
And how old are you?
- 37.
- 37.
What do you
think oughta happen?
Oh, here's a good one.
"Is Miss vag*na
thinking about Mister p*nis?
What is she thinking?"
What's up with that?
Do you ever watch
television much?
You ever watch a program
called Dateline NBC?
Well, there's
something I gotta tell ya:
I'm Chris Hansen
with Dateline NBC,
and we're doing a
story on.
God...
Now, you're free to walk
out of this house right now,
but if there's
anything else you wanna say,
now would be
the time to say it.
Sheriff's office!
Down!
Get down!
On the ground!
On the ground!
Put your hands
behind your back!
pensive ethereal music
Tonight,
a Dateline hidden camera
investigation exposes a very
real threat to your children:
online sexual predators.
When you watch
To Catch a Predator,
you can see right away why a
show like it would take America
by storm.
...and show
up at a home where they think a
minor is alone.
The problem, as you'll
see in our investigation,
is epidemic.
These kids range in age...
The show began when
NBC Dateline hired this online
civilian group called
"Perverted Justice" to find
online predators in chatrooms.
Enter a group
called "Perverted Justice,"
whose mission is to do what
it believes law enforcement
doesn't always have
the resources to do:
going after
internet predators.
And they do it by
posing as kids online.
They have the
decoy, who opens the door --
either a boy or a girl.
These will have been
adults who happen to look
much younger than they are.
They will pretend to be the
child that wants to have sex,
or something like that.
I'm just gonna go
and get my hair ready.
- I'll be right back.
- Take your time.
- I'm excited, by the way.
- Me too.
And then, you have
Chris Hansen coming out...
So, you're excited too?
And ask them
what they're doing there --
you know, what
they think they're doing.
- I'm sorry.
- Please have a seat.
I'm sorry.
What were
you doing here?
As an ethnographer, I
study why people behave the way
they do.
What first interested me
about To Catch a Predator
is how it is
that grown men can
be so vile when it comes to
what they assume are kids,
and how it is that
we seem to enjoy
watching these same men
being humiliated on TV.
So how can I help you?
Go ahead, have a seat.
In that moment...
time stops.
I suggest you sit down.
What you're seeing is
effectively someone else's life
end.
And they realize it.
The goal of the show was to
educate people about the evils
of the internet -- the
"stranger danger" folk.
But it ended up
shocking an entire nation.
Online, on the
street, at school,
pedophiles seize every
opportunity to try and connect
with your children, and one
reporter is doing what he can,
and he's doing a lot to
expose these offenders.
Dateline NBC's Chris Hansen!
I don't understand why the
guys sit down and talk to you!
Well...
I don't know why they
don't just walk out the door!
Why do they sit
down and talk to you?!
Well, my theory is this: that
a large percentage of these
- guys...
- Yeah.
Have an addiction,
a compulsion,
they wanna get caught...
Explain to me; help
me to understand.
I-- I can't!
Because there is no reason!
Take me inside your
mind; what's goin' on?!
Just bored.
Why did you do it?
Help me to understand!
I don't know!
Well, why did you come here?
Help me to understand.
Because I'm a
sick son of a b*tch.
I'm not there
to beat these guys up.
I'm wanna find out what's
going on in their mind --
what led them to
walk in this door.
You came over here planning
to have oral sex with a
12-year-old girl.
I just...
I've had that fantasy
in the back of my head!
Fantasy?
- About being with a young girl?
- A young girl, yes.
Well, what do you think
should happen to you?
I don't know why you're
asking me stuff like this!
I mean...
Well, why do you think
I'm curious about all this?
I could tell you're
a therapist! I know...
- I mean--
- You think I'm a therapist?
In many cases, they
stay and they talk to me!
They tell me the whole story!
Is there anything else you
want people to know about your
situation?
My life is screwed.
I'm done.
They may be in trouble,
but maybe now,
they're gonna get help.
This is probably
what I needed...
to...
straighten up.
You've scared the
hell out of me.
I need to see a psychiatrist
because of the way everything
is going in my life.
Well, why don't
you go ahead and...
I hope you get that help.
As he
gets up to leave,
officers are in
position, ready to arrest him.
Sheriff's office!
Hands up!
Hands up!
- Well, you're free to go.
- Well, you're free to go.
You're free to
walk out that door.
Thank you.
So, I can just walk out?
No problem?
- On your way.
- Thank you.
It's nice to meet you.
And, obviously,
you're free to go.
We can't keep you
here; you're free to go.
You're free to leave,
obviously, if you wanna go.
That's the wrong way, though.
Get down!
Get down! Get down!
Police! Stop!
Please,
please, please, help me!
Oh, dear God!
Dear God!
I don't think
I had any sort of idea
how big the show was.
To me, it was like,
"A couple of random
people are gonna see this,
but it's probably not
my big acting break."
Little did I know that it
was going to live on...
probably my whole
entire life 'til I die.
I will probably
always, in some universe,
be known as "the decoy."
Should we talk to random
strangers online that we
don't know?
I talk to some
but they're nice.
What?
I talk to random
strangers that I don't know.
But they're super nice.
See, that's not a good plan,
because they can be-- they can
look like they're super nice,
but they're not always
super nice.
Older guys are better!
Better at a lot of things!
I'm more mature; I
don't need people my age.
Fine, if--
honestly, this is stupid.
If you don't want
to, then, seriously,
let's just get off the phone.
Two minutes?
All right,
awesome, see you then!
She just got
off the phone with him.
Sending the decoy out.
There he is.
Go out!
I had to look at it
as "This is an acting job..."
Are you coming?!
Come on!
"But it's one that
really heavily relies on me
doing my job correctly."
Have a seat. Will you
pour me a drink, please?
- Oh, yeah, sure!
- Awesome!
I'm just gonna go
get my bikini now...
Okay.
The improv
part was super important,
and my biggest goal was always
get them to
expose themselves --
like, get Chris Hansen
his best interview.
Why are you paranoid?!
Just picture me
naked and come on in!
I swear...
Why do you think
the show was so popular?
I think it brought a lot
of awareness to parents.
Like, I think that you get
sucked in because you're like,
"This is a problem."
And, also, I don't think people
realized TV could be like this
'til To Catch a Predator came
along and actually put it in
people's faces that,
like, this is real life,
it's not just,
you know, fiction.
My uncle is a
realtor and was helping rent
out my nana's house to NBC, and
so my dad went down helping
handle all the paperwork, and
they were explaining the show,
and that they hire an actress
from LA to fly in and play
an underage
girl, and he's like,
"My daughter is an actress,
and she looks
incredibly young for 18!"
This is actually the shot...
that gave me...
the job.
It was definitely
the dance belt.
That definitely says
"12-year-old girl," right?
Do you think it's weird
that your dad
volunteered you for that?
He had no idea what he
was getting himself into.
More so himself than me.
I was fine!
My job was truly...
"Be a face," right?
That's what they
explained to me!
Casey, can you hear me?
Go ahead and, uh,
open the door for him.
Hey, come on in!
On the steps,
opening the door.
- He's in the kitchen, call out!
- Hey, I'm in here!
The
security guard told me,
he was like, "You
are God to them.
That's why it's so powerful
you-- when you say 'Sit' and
point your
finger, they will sit."
And I was like, "Oh!
I have the upper hand here."
Oh my God!
I wanted a paycheck.
"Sure, yup, sign me up."
I look young.
And I think that was the...
"Okay!
Perfect, that's what we need."
I don't think it was...
I don't think they really
expected much of me as
an actor.
How ya doin', Stanley?
Doin' good?
Tough drive?
But it was a
little nerve-wracking.
It was nerve-wracking, um,
having to answer the door,
- um...
- Ya thirsty?
No?
Can I pour one for myself?
Make them-- welcome them in...
So, what do ya think
we should start with?
What are you thinking?
I think a lot of it,
though, too, was...
What is the, uh,
lesson plan for tonight?
"Don't blow the cover.
- You've got a ton of people here
- - who've been working hard now
for X amount of days --
that you'd let down."
It was kind of like a
cool g*ng that you're in,
making sure these bad
guys don't hurt any kids.
Seems like an okay club!
You know?
pensive ethereal music
I definitely see
that not all of these
people could recognize reality
versus fantasy.
Some of them were
so far in mentally,
that they couldn't
differentiate the two.
They know what
they're doing to a degree,
but it comes from this
place of non-acceptance,
loneliness, and fear.
And so, by sitting
safe on their computer,
at their home,
they found this easy in.
I gave them that full
permission to disobey any
thought that maybe
this isn't okay.
You didn't think I was real?
Well, that can be
anybody in that thing.
Yeah.
No, I'm real.
The men would write
themselves a pornographic film,
which showed up in a chat log.
And they wanted to follow
through on this fantasy they
co-created with the show,
where kids are hyper-sexualized
and sexually available.
Yeah, I'm pretty excited.
Are you excited?
Yeah!
And where that is
actually okay at some level.
What do you wanna do?
This was the era of
Britney Spears and young girls
all the time on TV
as sexual objects.
Finally
agrees and he says,
"Nice tummy, hun.
I want to lick that."
Why
are you paranoid?!
Just picture me
naked and come on in!
I'm
Chris Hansen with Dateline.
Talking to kids
or pretend kids -- decoys --
online is already a crime.
So, the show's only job...
is to get the men to the house,
just to sell that fantasy for
a few more minutes in person.
The parents aren't home.
The boy or girl is eager.
Come on in!
Come in!
And so, when
the men do get the courage,
eventually, to show up...
Oh my God...
It's even
better than their dreams.
Because the show
made it that way.
Okay,
out of the vehicle.
Hey!
Come on in!
Walking
into our undercover house is
39-year-old John Elliot.
We've hired this
19-year-old actress, Casey,
to be our decoy.
Using a screen name so
disturbing we can't broadcast
it, he tells the decoy
about his fantasy...
Oh!
Of
being with a young girl.
- "You were asking me about..."
- Yeah.
"What
I was daydreaming about.
Well, that's it.
You nude, and me licking you.
Gosh, you're pretty!"
Thank you!
So, what are your plans
or what are you thinking?
Kissing you.
Yeah?
You know, how we was
talking on the internet.
There were a few...
I wanted to just
be like, "Go home."
I'm a freshman in college, I'm
trying to figure out my life,
and one of the guys
that came, we were, like,
pretty similar.
And I'm just talking to some
guy on the beach about, like,
"College is rough!"
and, you know,
"Do I want this major?
Do I not?"
And it was very relatable.
And so badly, I just
wanted to be like,
"Go home. Go home!
Go home."
I just didn't-- I've just been
worried that it's all some...
just some crazy...
scheme.
What do you mean?
They pay for,
like, cops to, like,
pretend they're, like,
girls and like that.
- Are you serious?!
- Yeah!
So, I mean, I usually
don't worry about it...
But it was just,
like, so awkward,
I don't-- I don't know...
But I guess
everything's cool.
I mean, I just-- I
don't know, so...
But as
he's about to find out,
everything isn't cool.
- How it goin'?
- Pretty good, how you doin'?
Good!
How are you?
- I'm all right.
- What's happenin'?
You wanna be a
television reporter.
Yes.
Have you
ever been on TV before?
No.
Well, this is one
of those "good news, bad news"
situations, John.
I'm Chris Hansen
with Dateline NBC,
and we're doing To
Catch a Predator...
Please tell
me you're not! Please!
I do not wanna be ruined for
my-- I wanted to go to college
and everything!
I wanna go for
sports broadcasting!
I didn't realize
it at the time how taxing
it was...
emotionally and mentally.
Years later, I'm still
emotionally exhausted.
Like, I have never, like,
watched this post it airing
originally.
Like, over the years, I've had
my ways of being able to, like,
work through it, right?
But...
that's a lot for
someone to take in!
Yeah.
Greg, you stand there...
Before you started
working with Dateline,
what did you think
of the show?
Not-- I hadn't really seen it.
The, uh-- my staff
brought me a proposal
about...
child predators and some
sort of a sting operation.
That's when we
partnered with them,
and we did three stings.
Kentucky Attorney
General Greg Stumbo worked with
Dateline in Northern
Kentucky last spring.
Thanks for helping us.
To us, it was
just a natural fit.
Law enforcement is not equipped
to conduct these types of
operations at this point.
So the stings
went off without a hitch,
the prosecutions all went well,
so I got a lot of "Atta boys"
at home, you know, for being...
for doing this and
getting on national television.
But the point of it is
it needs to be addressed.
These people are out
there and they're dangerous,
but none of them had
criminal backgrounds,
so they'd never
been arrested before.
Unless we did
something of this nature,
they would have never been
brought to the forefront
because we had no idea
who these people were!
As a prosecutor,
aside from arresting
these men,
did you ever wonder
to yourself,
"Okay, we can put
these men in jail, sure.
But how can we fix
the problem?
How can we rehabilitate
these men?
How can we stop this
from happening? How can we--"
My job's not to
rehabilitate 'em,
my job's to make 'em be
responsible for the act
that they committed.
These are criminals --
these are hardened criminals --
that engaged...
in this particular type
of predatory conduct,
intentionally,
with malice aforethought,
you know, with all the criminal
intent that you can think of in
the world to harm that child.
And I have-- I have absolutely
no compassion for 'em.
I mean, um...
somebody asked me one time
what I thought about the death
penalty, and I said, "Well, I'd
sh**t the son of a b*tch myself
if they'd let me."
And...
But those are the
type of people that...
They're just dangerous.
I mean, they're just dangerous,
but we know they're out there,
and they're
dangerous for our children.
So what would you say
to someone who's critical
of the show?
You don't understand the
problem if you're critical.
Mister Chairman, I'm glad
to see Mister Chris Hansen
here today.
His Dateline NBC series of on
child predators has wakened
America to the dangers
our children face...
The more light
we shed upon this topic,
it's gonna have a chilling
effect on these crimes.
Nearly 130 men have surfaced
in our five investigations.
98 of them have been
charged criminally.
Seven have pleaded guilty.
Most people
didn't have any problem
with what we did.
Our next guest is the host
of the funniest comedy on
television.
It's called
To Catch a Predator.
If you haven't seen it, it's
like Punk'd for pedophiles.
It's a great show.
And you can watch it this
Wednesday night on NBC.
Please say hello
to Chris Hansen!
And people respond
to it, obviously.
When did you
realize this is gold?
Well...
after the second one, I
figured, "You know...
this is really compelling."
Uh-huh, yeah.
Oh, yeah, it is.
It's very compelling.
Have a cookie!
I made them!
You wanna explain yourself?
Wrap it around yourself.
And please sit on that stool.
What are you doing?!
Whose idea was it to tell
the guy to get naked before he
came in?
Well, occasionally, they
decoys will get a little
- playful in the chat.
- I don't-- I don't wanna, um...
be on the news.
You feel me?
We are filming.
I don't wanna
be on the news, dawg.
Well, it's a little
late for that, dawg.
It's news
gathering, you know,
so we don't need to get, uh...
- Permission.
- Permission.
- I mean, it's for a news show.
- I know!
And we're taping
what really happens.
I know!
I-- Could you see that guy...
You know, listen: amazing work.
Police!
Raise your hands!
You might think, "Boy,
is that gotcha journalism?"
or "Is that exploitative?"
I think anybody that's having
sex with children or trying to,
you guys should do this show
ev-- you should have your own
channel of this show.
You thought I was
a police officer?
Yeah, I have no idea
who you are.
Okay, well you do now.
- Hello, Homer.
- Ah!
I'm Chris Hansen
with Dateline NBC.
I'm Chris Hansen
with Dateline NBC.
Oh my God!
Most
recently, as of, you know,
this Spring when we
were sh**ting in Florida,
you know, guys
were coming in and,
before I could say, you
know, "I'm Chris Hansen,
Dateline NBC," they
were saying "I know,
I know, I know."
It's
almost like Candid Camera,
only with...
criminals that
get arrested and go to jail.
It's-- it's unbelievable.
Just come on over here
and face this wall for me.
You gotta anything on
you I need to know about?
Anything sharp?
Any needles or...
The only thing I
had was a pocketknife,
but I think they put that
in the bag.
Are you a counselor too?
Or...
No, I'm--
I'm an agent.
I'm with the Kentucky
Bureau of Investigation.
Oh, okay, I just
thought maybe you was a...
Okay.
So, you
are under arrest.
You understand that?
Oh yeah, definitely.
Yeah.
So this is--
this is raw footage
from the show,
from the interrogation rooms
after Chris
would do the arrests.
Okay.
Was this never aired?
Some did but not
in raw form like this.
Okay.
But this is
what I find interesting.
For me,
watching the raw footage
gives me
a very different feeling
than the broadcasted
episodes.
Can I talk
to you off camera?
I can't do that, I'm sorry.
Do you guys have
any help for me?
There-- there are a
number of ways to get help,
and we're gonna get
into that in the story.
My insurance covers therapy,
and that's
obviously what I need,
for obviously more than this
issue but a number of things.
If I...
Even if it was
something you...
I just don't...
I don't want this to
ruin the rest of my life.
I'm sorry, Mr. Hansen.
I'm sorry, all you guys.
I'm sorry...
if this does end up
on air, I'm sorry.
To show
these men as human beings,
this show kind of...
breaks down.
And maybe that's why it
didn't make it on TV.
Yes, he's maybe done
and said awful things...
but it shows some
humanity that's...
hard to ignore.
John W. Elliot.
A lot of Elliots
where I grew up.
Where'd you grow up?
I grew
up in Bell County.
You know where that is?
I'm sorry,
I don't.
You don't even
know where Bell County is?!
I thought
everybody knew where...
It's where the
Cumberland Gap is.
It sounds pretty.
It is; it's nice.
Maybe you can go
there some time.
Got a PGA Tour golf course...
- Sorry.
- You all right?
Yup.
You've
been through a lot.
I don't-- I don't
deserve any remorse.
I don't, mm-mm.
You know what, John?
You're gonna live through this.
No, I'm not.
I don't
like it when anybody sees me
like this.
I'm just embarrassed.
This is not typical
of a criminal interrogation.
This individual, you
know, if he serves his time,
if he goes through some sort
of rehabilitative process,
maybe he won't do it again,
maybe he can come back and--
and become a...
a productive member of society.
Uh...
But he needs to be
punished for his crime.
pensive ethereal music
You could offer me...
$10 million...
to film that
episode in Texas again.
And I wouldn't take it.
I wouldn't-- I would not
take it and be happy about that
decision.
Hello?
Hey, Will?
Hey, what are you doin'?
Nothin',
what are you doin'?
Nothin'.
I was looking up to see
how to get to where you are.
Are you
gonna come over?
Is it okay?
Yeah!
- Are you sure?
- Totally.
Hundred percent.
You leave yet?!
No...
You didn't leave yet?!
No.
Are you
gonna come or not?!
Yes, I shall.
Well, when are
you gonna come over?!
Well, a little later.
A little later?!
Yeah,
is that all right?
Yeah, I guess...
We saw a fella ride
his horse right up the street.
Took a good look at us.
If there's someone in there,
they know we're out here.
- Yeah.
- Chief said he felt
more comfortable calling
the TAC team out
to get through,
help pick them up, and...
Make an entry
with a TAC team?
- Make a forced entry.
- Okay.
If it has to be like that,
that's what he wants to do,
- so...
- Okay.
This is y'all's call on that.
We're on the phone now
calling the TAC team out
to get them in line.
Okay.
Apparently we're gonna have
a little waiting period
because, you know,
as I said--
Put together
the tactical team?
- Yep.
- Yeah, it won't take them
It won't take them long.
They're pretty quick.
Okay.
We called him
this morning on a fake call.
We got the number.
If somebody wants to call
and try to talk him out.
If he answers...
- Mind if I do it?
- I don't know.
Nine-seven-two...
five-two-four...
The sergeant's out here.
He's obtained
the telephone number.
He's attempting
telephone contact,
but it doesn't look like
he's getting a message.
Got a
detective back there?
All the way back.
Back to the fence.
Keep going.
He shot himself.
Oh, my god.
I don't know
if he's dead or not, so...
What can you tell us
about the scene?
It's just a g*nsh*t wound
to the head.
So...
Any idea on when it occurred?
I don't know for sure.
Okay.
They're calling
for CareFlite, so...
Okay.
They'll land somewhere and
get an ambulance
and take him out.
Okay.
Y'all go ahead and scoot back.
- The ambulance--
- Yeah.
Well, there's going to be
some controversy.
It's better
that he did it when, uh,
as they were coming in,
as opposed to...
I know it's preliminary,
you guys are still piecing
this together here,
but as best you can tell us,
lieutenant,
what happened
as the entry team came in?
As they made entry,
they confronted the suspect.
I believe he was
in the hallway
and he told them
he wasn't gonna hurt them,
and then shot himself
in the head.
And he had a p*stol
in his hand?
- Small caliber.
- And shot himself in his head.
All right, lieutenant, thanks.
I appreciate it.
We're having fun?
You hear they got a
300-pounder out there?
- No.
- Showed up at the house.
- Are you serious?
- They already arrested him.
He wanted--
Brad couldn't remember--
he either wanted
to take a dump on the boy
or have the boy
take a dump on him.
Oh, man.
I know I was at the house
when I heard what happened.
It might have been an
hour after that that...
we were told, "That's it.
We're done.
We're done with you guys."
And then...
I know I've blocked that out.
I know I have.
I have.
Um...
This morning, I-- I...
clicked a link on YouTube,
and it brought me to...
it started to
play the phone call.
Hello?
Hey, is this Will?
And I heard
myself say "Hello?"
- Hey, Will.
- How are ya?
Hey, how are you?
I'm good, thanks.
Did you get the dogs walked?
And I had to
immediately-- I-- I...
I was done.
I didn't wanna play
that game anymore.
It's not
a place I like to live.
I don't like knowing that I
could have been the last person
that this guy had a
conversation with,
outside of when
police showed up.
This was something I had
started to pack up as nicely
as I could and...
bury as far...
back as possible.
And then, I heard from you.
I was watching
the six o'clock news that day,
and there was a short report
of a man dying,
and I just thought,
"How does somebody die in
the production of
a television show?"
It's all supposed
to be about justice,
but a News 8 investigation
shows that when the motives
of the media and law
enforcement get confused,
justice can be meager,
and, in this case, tragic.
We were one of
the first new organizations to
investigate To Catch
a Predator in Texas.
They seemed to have elements
of kind of a traveling circus;
they would go to a town,
they would troll for bad guys.
The Collin County
DA, he said, "Well,
are the police
working for the TV show?
Who's employed by whom?"
All of that led to big
questions from John Roach.
The Murphy Police
Department contacted us about
being part of this
To Catch a Predator.
We responded in writing
and told them we weren't
gonna do it, advised
them not to do it,
they were making
a huge mistake,
and the phrase we used:
"We're in the law enforcement
business, not show business."
Well, they ignored us, and
went ahead and did it anyway.
We got into it and found out
that some policemen were
wearing a camera -- this was
way before body cameras --
simply to give an action-packed
shot when their confrontation
went down.
Bill Conradt
was a former Kaufman County
District Attorney.
Now, his sister,
Patricia Conradt,
is suing NBC for $105 million.
The entertainment
industry cannot act as police,
judge, jury, executioner.
Then, 20/20
did a national story,
stemming from
our investigation.
Hello, and welcome to 20/20.
It's riveting television --
the sight of alleged pedophiles
being caught in a
sting, cornered,
thrown to the
ground and cuffed.
It's all part of a
popular NBC series,
but now, there are serious
questions about what goes on
behind the scenes.
As Murphy police detectives,
Sam Love and Walt Weiss
played a big role
in the operation.
Did you intend to
have sex with her?
Both men were seen
on the program interrogating
suspects, at times, they say,
following directions from the
Dateline producer.
By God, when they
wanted a camera in place,
it was there.
When they wanted certain things
carried out that made it easier
for them to put the
television show together,
by God, that
problem was addressed.
But the criminal
cases were secondary.
Chris Hansen came
back to the department and the
police are running up wanting
to get pictures for 'em.
I grabbed the camera
and took the pictures,
and they asked me,
"What about you?"
and I said, "Nah.
I'm cool."
That's not our boss.
He is not a police officer,
he's not a
prosecuting attorney.
They're running a TV show!
And it looked more and
more and more like...
somebody was being given carte
blanche to come in and direct
operations at the
police department.
Chris Hansen is
acting as an agent of the
police in this instance.
He's interrogating them!
Are you her father or
something like that?
I'll get to that in a minute.
Are you a private
investigator or police or...?
I'll get to
that in just a minute.
Am I gonna go to jail?
That's not up to me.
And the police are gonna
use that information --
they're gonna submit
it to the prosecutor --
so this perpetrator,
he doesn't know that he
has a right not to talk,
he has a right
to have an attorney,
all those things.
I'm looking at the transcripts,
so it's best not to lie,
okay?
I've read the whole thing, so
you might as well just tell me.
It was just perfectly
clear that these cases were not
prosecutable.
They went over
there and did that at that
house because it would do
something for the show,
not something for society, not
something in the interest of
law enforcement.
And the role that
I played in it,
that's a stain on my soul...
that I'm gonna live with...
if I'm any kind of a
human being at all.
Uh...
I...
I coulda shut
that thing down --
at least that part of it --
just simply by walking out
the back door and
going to see somebody.
I don't know what
else I have to tell,
but if you have
any more questions,
I'll sit for 'em.
So the episode
eventually aired?
It did.
exciting rock music
- This is a nice house.
- Thank you!
Nice house,
and guess who's home.
Why don't you have a
seat right there, please?
Get ready.
Here come the cops.
- Roll over.
- Get on the ground!
Hands
behind your back now!
- I guess I'm under arrest, huh?
- You think?
Also tonight,
something that has never
happened before.
Police move in on a
surprising suspect,
and there are
deadly consequences.
We all
knew who he was.
Nobody anticipated the kind
of outcome that resulted.
Mm, and I talked to Dateline's
Chris Hansen about this tragic
turn of events,
and this was his reaction
to what unfolded that day.
Everybody on
the scene would have rather,
uh, have had, uh, Bill Conradt
tell his side of the story,
and, if necessary,
have his day in court,
but that's not
the choice he made.
No, it
certainly wasn't.
Make sure you catch Dateline's
next predator investigation
Tuesday night.
And, coming up,
oops, she left it again!
Britney's second stint in
rehab's over and done with,
so can anyone or anything
convince her to get the help
she so desperately needs?
But first, Jay Leno shows us
the latest hero to hit NBC's...
must-see SC!
It's comin' up next!
I need a hero
I'm holding
out for a he--
Good God.
He's standing down the hallway
with a handgun in his hand --
a small caliber g*n -- and he
says, "I'm not gonna hurt you
guys," and puts the...
g*n to his head
and shoots himself.
Wow.
So, obviously, they've
confiscated the computers from
him home, and
they're-- you know,
investigators are
going through those now.
Okay.
And, uh, now, this
book comes out, uh...
To Catch a Predator, this
has a lot of tips for...
It does, it does.
You know...
There was no debrief,
no sense of "Let's
talk about how this happened
and what kind of culpability
we have or anyone else --
police -- have.
There was none of that.
Meanwhile, back at the house,
men continue to show up.
Come on in!
How you doing?
Because I'm not there,
the decoy invites a suspect
to come up to the house,
but then quickly
locks the door.
There's one more potential
predator we'd like you to meet.
The show ended
after six more episodes,
but, if anything, it
had people watching more.
Reruns of it
continued to air for years.
All the episodes went online
when that technology developed.
So, even though the show ended,
that didn't seem to
lessen the show's appeal.
This
girl was how old?
Did they learn things
from what happened in Murphy?
I don't know.
They're still out
there doing the show,
are they not?
What's happening with it?
Are you inside yet?
I'm outside, yes.
Okay, well...
like I said, just meet
me by the milk, okay?
All right, let's go.
Hey.
I'm the 12-year-old boy
you came to f*ck with.
You're gonna get
smacked if you walk away.
- Hey, what was you gonna do?
- Tell the f*cking truth!
Don't lie, bro!
Excuse me, everybody!
This guy's here to
meet a 12-year-old boy!
tense minimal music
Since To
Catch a Predator,
there have been tons of
predator catch groups online:
regular everyday civilians
going out and catching these
predators who are trying to
meet up with boys and girls.
This man is here to
meet a 13-year-old boy!
There's
usually a lot of yelling...
r*pe a little boy!
They're getting very
aggressive with the predator.
This man is trying to
pick up a little boy on the
internet!
Excuse me, everybody!
This man's here to
meet a 14-year-old girl!
It's great that
they're catching people,
but I was like, "Why is no one
doing the whole Chris Hansen
thing -- like, dressing up in
the blazer and printing out the
chat logs?"
He's sharp, he's witty,
he has a sense of humor.
I was like, "You
know, I'm gonna...
impersonate Chris
Hansen the best I can,
and see if people like it."
All right, so,
here we are again,
in Grand Rapids.
We have T Coy the Decoy here.
This is our potential
predator. He is on his way.
He's gonna be here in
just a few minutes.
He said
seven minutes away.
Seven
minutes away, Skeet.
Let's get into positions.
Okay.
Get his initial reaction.
I see him.
She sees him.
Okay, okay.
Yay!
- How are you?
- Pretty good.
- Good to see you!
- You too.
Sit over there.
- You don't look 14 at all.
- I know.
- At all!
- Yeah.
But my pictures do.
- Sometimes! Some of them.
- Yeah.
Do you
wanna go get food?
Or, wait, are we
going to your house,
or are we just gonna stay here?
How are you?
What the f*ck is this?
Uh, sir, I'm with the
Predatorial Investigation Unit.
We do have the
police on standby.
I just have a
few questions for you.
So do you--
Can I
please just leave?
Do you
have an ID on you?
- Can I please just leave?
- I just have--
I will never
come back and you'll never
hear from me again.
Well, help me
understand first what is...
We just wanna
ask some questions.
You made the
decision to come in here.
Can I make
the decision to leave?
Well, it's going to
be up to the police to decide,
and when they arrive in
just a few minutes...
- What?!
- We'll go over that.
What?!
No!
I mean, I think
it's best we all just,
you know, wait here.
I mean, you can feel
free to, you know,
look through it, but these are
basically all the highlights of
- the...
- Okay.
- Things he was saying.
- I see.
Yeah, that's pretty much...
Yeah, let me take pictures
of that real quick for our
- evidence server.
- Sure.
There's a phone
call with him as well.
He says multiple times,
he talks about To
Catch a Predator,
"I don't wanna get in trouble."
Here, I'm just
gonna set this down.
Yeah, go for it.
Our alleged predator
in the Sheriff's truck.
And we're gonna
wait around and see,
you know, what's
going to happen.
Get a shot of, like, the
concerned citizens around here.
You guys got
more stuff lined up or...?
Yeah, we've got I think
one or two more lined up for
- tonight.
- Yes, sir.
All right, well...
Anything happening
with this guy, or...?
- I have no idea.
- Okay.
Once everything
gets put into a pile,
the detectives look at it, and
take it to the prosecutor.
- Gotcha.
- All right.
Thank you so
much, sir, appreciate it.
See you in a half hour!
If you upload
a predator catch video,
and you don't
have police in it,
they're taking it down.
But it doesn't even have
to be real police presence.
If you've got some fake, uh,
police light overlay right
there, and there's
my good friend Chet.
Yeah, we just dress
him as a police officer,
we had a badge
there, it says "Officer,"
but it says "Security" on the
bottom side -- it's not even...
Yeah, it's, like, totally fake.
And you put in all
these sound effects,
and we gave him a walkie
talkie, and his shirt says
"Police," so, to YouTube's
eyes, when they look at this,
they're gonna see a badge
and that it says "Police."
Do you see what you
do as different
than what
Chris Hansen did?
He's a
journalist, you know,
and I'm kind of just, uh...
I think I'll always,
for the most part,
just be looked at as...
a YouTuber who's just-- just
does it for the clicks and the
likes and the
views and all that.
But he was, you know, my first
inspiration for doing this sort
of thing.
There's never been a detective
that solved a m*rder that
didn't get paid for it,
so...
why shouldn't I be able
to monetize off of, um...
catching these guys
like the original show,
and making this content
for people's entertainment?
Who's the baby?
Are ya chilly?
Do ya need a shirt, baby boy?
Go live.
I'm not
gonna force ya to do nothing.
I'm glad
you're my boyfriend, though.
We could
go to a mall somewhere.
Yeah, okay.
It is funny to watch
people that do bad things...
crumble,
get hurt.
It's laughable.
It is f*cking funny when a bad
person gets what is coming to
them, however you
wanna look at it.
Um...
it's awesome.
It is.
Right?
"Are you hairless?
When's the last
time you had sex?"
If I can talk
to these guys for 16 hours
a day -- like, if
they are engaging --
they're not engaging
with somebody's kid.
What made you
do this work?
Um, I was requested to do it.
I'm a victim -- or survivor,
whatever you wanna call it --
but, um...
you know, I, myself, was taken
advantage by a child predator,
so...
um...
Sorry, I'm, like, looking away.
Uh...
But somebody -- another
catcher, actually -- was like,
"Hey, I think you
would be good at this,"
'cause I talk...
I come with,
like, sound effects.
Like, my personality,
when I'm doing something,
I'm like doo-doo-doo-doo.
Like, I just-- I talk
weird, I love dogs,
I'm always talking in
this, like, weird little...
voice that I talk to animals
in, and I think it was, like...
"You're a character.
Like, you could play a
character" kind of thing.
Tell me how it feels when
you're helping catch these guys.
Oh, it makes me feel-- it
makes me feel good because...
you know, I
subject myself to this, like,
perversion all day.
And it's like, um...
I don't know, you
finally just get to, like,
f*ck' squash the
bug or I-- I don't know,
um...
That's why, in
some of my things,
I'm like-- I sound so
immature because there's,
like-- there's a little
kid in me that's like,
"Yes!
f*ck you!"
You know
what I mean? Like...
And I start...
yelling and-- and
acting immature because...
I feel like that's what
I would've wanted to do, like,
back then --
like, embarrass them.
How are you?
Uh, sir,
I'm with the, uh,
Predatorial Investigation Unit.
We do have the
police on standby.
What's your name?
I genuinely believe
that they believe that they're
doing the right thing in
getting these predators
off the street.
It's the means that trouble me.
Because of the work
I've been doing for,
what, 20 years now
with different groups of
people in...
in different types of
challenging circumstances,
my interest is always
in seeing the humanity --
the complexity --
whereas they can only do what
they do because they refuse to.
I don't think I'm any more
moral than any of these
people are; it's...
maybe more sensitive?
I don't know what it is, but...
Yeah, I felt uncomfortable
being there.
I think I felt complicit.
I thought you were 14?
I am.
What?
I am!
Ain't no damn way.
Yes!
- There ain't no way.
- I'm gonna be 15 in September.
- You're f*cking with me.
- No! Gimme one of those.
There's no one in here?
- How are you?
- Aw, f*ck me.
Yeah,
"f*ck me" is right.
Sir, go and have a
seat right here.
Oh, don't...
It's okay, it's okay.
You're good,
nobody is gonna hurt you.
No, no, we're not gonna
hurt you, we just wanna talk.
We have
the police on standby.
Please just have
a seat right there.
We just wanna talk, man.
It's okay, just breathe.
Yeah, just breathe.
It's okay.
Breathe.
Deep breaths.
I got a water for you.
I've got a water.
I don't wanna touch you,
but I've got a water for you.
Don't touch me.
It's okay,
nobody's gonna touch you.
We just wanna talk.
I don't
wanna lose everything.
We just wanna talk.
So just think about
your actions right now
before you do something crazy.
Just breathe, drink the water.
It was sealed.
I'm trying to help you.
I have spent so
much of my life to try to get
off this pattern.
Okay.
Well, after today, you
know, you're gonna...
Well, I hope, at least, that
you're going to take the steps
that you need to take to...
better yourself.
If you guys
know programs,
I'll take suggestions too.
'Cause I honestly just don't
know where to go from this,
other than...
other than the right
steps, not going backwards.
- I don't have...
- I'm sure we could--
The capacity
to go backwards.
I'm sure we could pull
a few strings and...
see if there's
anything we can...
align for ya.
I can't
afford to lose my job.
I can't afford to lose
everything I've worked for,
every friend I've
had will just...
I can't.
I don't know...
don't know how much
longer I'd be around if I do.
I really...
I just don't--
We don't want it
to come to anything like that.
I don't either, 'cause
I want to be around my son.
- I just...
- Okay.
I just don't wanna be
at this point of life anymore.
Yeah.
Well, we're gonna...
Nobody wants to
be at rock bottom.
No, I mean, we're gonna pull
some strings and see if we can,
you know, get...
You someone that
you can talk to.
But, Eric, if that's all
you have to say for yourself,
then...
what I have to let you know is
that I am Skeet Hansen with the
Predatorial Investigation Unit,
and we're doing an online
series about adults who
try to meet...
underage girls online for sex,
and you've just been Skeeted.
If there's anything else
you have to say again,
you know, we'd love to hear it.
If not, then, um, our friends
in the Grand Rapids Police
Department will be
here shortly, and...
they're going to address
the situation and see if...
they can point you in
the right direction to...
See if they can
help get out on track.
Exactly, to get you on track.
Yeah.
We all good?
That was the sheriff's office.
They said they're not going to
dispatch an officer
in a timely fashion.
Oh, damn!
Um, yeah the only thing is,
he's like kind of...
You know, he's kind of
suicidal, so...
He is!
We need to do a wellness
check on this dude.
Cause I can't have that on
my shoulders,
that's for sure.
So what do we do?
Um, just call 911 and ask them,
Hey, what do I do if
there's somebody here that I
think is gonna k*ll themselves.
I have a question.
So we're doing two
separate things.
They are doing Skeet's stuff.
And we are doing a documentary
about this stuff.
I'm wondering if
you would sign
an appearance release
form for us?
We can't use your face
unless you sign it.
They can, but I'm just curious
if you could sign it for us.
So, wait a second.
- I'm kind of confused.
- Yeah.
They can't publish my face
on the internet, correct?
We're doing two separate
kind of things.
I can just really speak
about ours.
You can also say no.
I'd like to say no.
It's just this is a pretty
bad part of...
I'm not trying to hide this
necessarily, it just doesn't...
I don't need to see another
reminder of it.
Especially once I've got
myself where I want to be.
- Okay, I understand.
- I appreciate you asking.
I don't want to look back
at myself as...
...the person that was
stuck in this.
Okay, I understand.
Sheriff's here.
Well, uh...
that was some heavy sh*t.
That was crazy.
He said he's seen one of my
videos before at some point!
And he was laughing at it!
Laughing at how...
dumb these guys are!
What we do, and I quote
is better than To Catch
a Predator.
He did say that!
I don't know if I can
agree fully 'cause TCaP is...
the OG, but...
you know, I'm-- I'm
flattered by Eric's words!
I actually kinda
feel bad for this guy.
'Cause, like, he needs help.
Like, obviously we know
why he's here, right?
- So...
- Yeah, well...
He's a monster for that, right?
But...
he needs help.
He actually needs help.
So I hope...
like we said tonight, I hope
that he gets the help he needs.
If this puts him on the
straight and narrow and it
saves his life, then,
as far as I'm concerned,
the last two years and change
that we've been doing this is
- worth it.
- Sure.
If we saved a life, that's...
- it's worth it.
- That's it.
That's it.
A child's life and
a predator's life;
look at that.
I see To Catch a
Predator as an attempt to make
a public service entertaining.
But do you think it's
even possible
for something designed
as entertainment
to be a public service?
Great question, actually.
Very...
You've thought about
this a great deal, clearly.
Well, it's because I'm
thinking about
the morality of what I'm asking
people to look at.
And even what I'm making
and doing with this film
and why I'm making it.
Mm-hm, why are you?
Um...
I was abused by a
child predator.
And...
for me,
I've been on a lifelong
quest to understand...
how someone could do that.
And partly what drew me to
the show when I was young...
was that first initial
question Chris would ask:
- "Help me understand."
- Mm-hm.
But the show never
really answered that question
for me.
I don't think it was ever
really interested in the
answer.
So the more I've learned,
the more I've
been disappointed.
Wow.
- I'm-- I'm sorry.
- No, it's, um...
For me, it's, um...
I do think it's taught
me a lot of empathy.
And I'm sorry that
the show tries to...
crush that.
Mm-hm.
You know,
what you just said,
- this Chris Hansen question
- - "Help me understand" --
and that never
being really answered,
'cause it's not really
about understanding,
that reminded me;
when you
look at stings --
you know, where predators
are confronted by hunters --
always, you find hunters
asking, time and again,
"Why?
Why did you do that?"
You know, "What do
you think would happen?
Why a child?"
And they keep asking the
question because there's never
an answer forthcoming;
there really never is.
And I wonder if that's maybe
because the predator themselves
- - himself, quite
often -- doesn't know.
Just doesn't know, you know?
But understanding is
not the goal of the show.
I honestly didn't
even really realize that I was
a victim until I was in my 20s.
I also didn't
realize until my 20s.
I watched To Catch a
Predator in my dorm room,
and part of what my
fascination was with it...
- was...
- Watching them go down.
Trying very
hard to understand...
how a human could do
this to another human.
Mm-hm.
- Especially a child.
- Yeah.
Anyone, though.
The grin on
Skeeter's face is priceless.
I don't believe
anything he's saying.
He just got two hours of
free therapy with y'all.
God, he has, like, some
evil-lookin' f*ck' eyes.
Yeah.
I mean, I haven't even
gotten this far yet,
because I'm just like...
"Whatev--"
You know what I mean?
Everybody likes to f*ck.
I don't understand why...
I mean, I guess
sexual addiction is, like,
a real thing but...
I don't know.
I don't know about this guy.
He was there to do it.
And he even
brought her alcohol.
Like, that's crazy.
Mm.
Like, if you're
gonna let a kid...
if you're gonna listen to
a little kid's suggestion,
then...
I don't know, that's just...
dangerous.
But it is hard not
to feel bad for him.
Maybe that's why I don't
wanna watch-- maybe that's why
I, like, haven't...
gotten very far through this,
'cause I don't wanna sit here
and feel bad for him.
I am a human, even
though I can be a b*tch.
Like, I don't know
why I feel bad for him.
I guess 'cause it's sad.
Hey,
Chris, nice to see you.
angelic harp music
Yeah.
Yeah, I've seen that.
That's great.
I used to remember all
the shoots and then...
they kind of fade together.
I'm sorry, David.
You've got
a little more room.
Keep going,
keep going, keep going.
Yup, oh, you're in.
Okay, you're good.
Do you want a water
next to your coffee cup?
That'd be awesome.
Thank you.
Who knew
that, at 64 years old,
I would have
three generations
of followers?
TruBlu is your home
for previous episodes of
Takedown with
Chris Hansen,
documentary films,
and exclusive investigations.
400,000 subscribers
on the YouTube channel!
My audience is 75 to 15!
Very good!
Really, that
was all fantastic.
Thank you.
I need a cup of coffee.
You guys want
something from Starbucks?
There you go.
You're very welcome.
Chris is
a news guy at heart.
You know, he really
wants to do news.
And, uh...
you know, when we can
afford to do it, we'll do it.
Tell me this isn't
the classic newsroom.
It'll look like Vice in here...
six months from now.
When BLM got popular, when
people got very upset with the
police, Hollywood
canceled all their crime shows,
and they canceled Cops,
and they canceled Live PD,
they canceled
Crime Watch Daily,
they canceled Paw Patrol
to show that they
don't support the police.
It's an evergreen genre;
people always wanna watch it.
People like to be
glad it's not them.
People like to compare
themselves to the depraved to
feel better about who they are.
I don't know what everyone's
motivation is for watching this
stuff, but there's
an audience for it.
So, I cherry-picked the most
revolutionary crime show,
and I went to my
friend Chris Hansen,
and we reinvented it.
We've become very good
at luring these men,
and we wanna make sure
all the prosecutions stick.
We're not gonna stop.
I think the
investigation we did in
Cambodia was
instrumental in my drive
when it came to the
predator investigations,
without question.
Tonight, we take you
undercover, inside the world
of child sex trafficking,
a world in which, each year,
by some estimates, hundreds of
thousands of girls and boys are
bought, sold, or kidnapped,
and then forced to have sex
with grown men.
This is the first
investigation that shocked the
conscience of our viewers.
This
girl says she's nine.
She's joined by
another who says she's 10.
Both say they know how
to perform oral sex,
and they even tell us
how much it will cost.
And one of the
Americans who was caught in the
investigation was a
anesthesiologist in Guam.
We caught him on hidden camera
talking about how to have sex
with a child, and we
wanted to confront him.
We get on a plane,
fly to Guam,
go to the doctor's office,
go to the parking structure...
here comes
Jerry Albom.
My heart's in my
throat, and I'm gonna...
approach him.
Hey, Dr. Albom?
Chris Hansen with Dateline NBC.
How are you?
- Good, nice to meet you.
- Good.
We're doing an investigation
into the trade of underage
prostit*tes in Cambodia.
And we know that you've
frequented some of the places
in and around Phnom Penh,
with underage girls.
No.
Not to my knowledge.
May I show
you a videotape?
Yes.
So this was
basically your first sting?
This was showing
them the chat logs?
Right!
You've got one shot.
You've gotta get it.
And he came up with a
bunch of c*ck excuses.
I was drunk or...
or may have been
slipped a pill, who knows?!
That is not--
Drunk or
slipped a pill?!
Right!
- That's your defense?
- Yes!
And it was an amazing
piece of television.
That story airs,
we're at the airport,
and some of the girls who had
been rescued show up in their
tuktuk taxi, and...
we all get banana splits.
And they were in a
much better place,
they looked great,
they're dressed properly,
they're taking classes.
It gets time for me
to board the plane,
and I look back at these
girls, and they're weeping.
It was one of those incredible
moments that reminds you
that somebody's life is better
because of the story we did.
I truly believe that's the kind
of reporting I'm supposed to be
doing.
We've just taken it
to the next level.
It sounds
like he's coming!
It sounds like it.
He wants to wait for the
sun to go down 'cause he's,
- uh, nervous.
- He doesn't...
He wants to make sure
there's no cameras.
Correct.
How do you feel
about the amateur predator
hunters that have been
directly inspired by you?
I work
in conjunction with
law enforcement.
Vigilante predator catchers
are doing this for clicks
and profit.
What I do is for a
greater purpose.
Police, don't move
Police, don't move!
pensive ethereal music
Three, two, one...
In my 20 years of investigating
predators seeking children for
sex, I have come across a
number of cases where the
predator is 18.
Now, this could
be controversial;
a lot of people see it as a
Romeo and Juliet situation.
But it's ill*gal.
In this case, Hunter was a
little less than honest.
But he knew what he was
doing was against the law.
One for safety?
You got the
project name for me?
Takedown: Hunter.
Takedown: Hunter.
When we look at
the final cut of Hunter,
we both need to be
sensitive to the fact that,
you know, this is
his age and all that.
Yeah...
But you were gentle, right?
You were gentle--
Yeah, you'll see it.
I mean, you'll have last...
last pass at it, and as will I.
Was 18-- who was
he there to meet?
A 15-year-old boy.
15 to 18.
Like, in Ohio, that's legal.
In Michigan,
apparently, it's not,
but they allow a three-year
spread for a senior to date a
- freshman.
- Right.
Um, so, it's like...
that must be a Michigan thing.
But...
it is what it is.
I mean, uh...
I think people
will be forgiving.
You know, I hope...
you know, hope we're
not ruining his life.
A task
force team member searches
- Hunter for his wallet.
- Turn your volume up.
We
realize Hunter had been 18 for
some time.
It's time for
Hunter to take a seat.
The tears start flowing,
and the begging begins.
Please just don't ruin my life.
Please.
Please.
They asked
if I was Hunter's mom,
and I said that I was, and
they told me that he had been
arrested.
He only went three blocks away!
And he walked!
It was the summer before his
senior year in high school.
Top of his game in
choir and in drama,
and...
about to have the
year of his life.
I started getting
phone calls of people...
informing me that my son was
going to be on the next episode
that was airing.
In my head, I didn't believe
that they were actually going
to air this 18-year-old's...
mistake,
that Chris Hansen would
be willing to stoop so low
for his show.
I just don't know how the
worst day of my life could be
something that...
people are getting snacks for.
Hunter couldn't go
back to his high school.
He was being
charged with felonies,
and at the arraignment,
the judge explained to us
kind of his...
stipulations for Hunter,
and they included no contact
with any person under the
age of 17 without the presence
of a supervising adult.
Hunter could not be in the
same house alone with his
16-year-old brother.
No school.
No job.
He lived in his room.
And we tried to make it...
great.
And partly so that Hunter
had kind of like a haven,
we got heavy drapes
and we took down any...
identifiers outside the, um...
We took down any identifiers
outside of the house,
so that, um...
Sorry.
Do you want to go
talk to him?
I don't
think he's cried since then.
I don't think
that, like, until...
right now, he's really
necessarily acknowledged what
he's lost.
Um...
And, like, everything
that was taken from him.
I wish Chris...
could feel one
percent of our pain.
Even though it fixes nothing.
By the way,
all the food's down there!
All kinds of food, okay?
This is our third
network, and hopefully,
it earns a bunch of
advertiser revenue.
We put some fresh
episodes up, boom.
13.4 million views, two
million hours watched.
We're gonna get the plaque
'cause we have over 100,000
subscribers, so that's good.
This is the culmination
of 40 years of being a
television
journalist right here.
Everything I've done --
all the Emmys, all the
Edward R. Murrow awards,
- all the years at NBC
- - all led to this.
.- Let's go!
Suspect is
armed and extremely dangerous.
I'm Chris Hansen.
I am Chris Hansen.
cool rock music playing
pensive synth music
I've been watching
your show since I was like 10.
Oh, wow!
Thank you!
Well, thank you!
- Where are you from?
- Atlanta.
- Thank you very much.
- It's so nice to meet you.
Nice to see you too.
Thanks for being here.
Hey, Chris!
Long time, no see!
18 years later!
You are my
true crime star.
Oh, well, thank you.
We're gonna dedicate
this to all the victims that we
pour our life into.
Appreciate you.
Take care.
Chris Hansen
and the Sheriff of Genesee
County, Michigan,
Chris Swanson!
John...
John...
John...
There's cameras
everywhere, John.
John...
No, you're
not in charge here, John.
The cameras aren't
gonna get turned off,
so that's not on the table.
'Cause we're here
covering the commission of an
- alleged felony.
- You are?
Yeah.
John, I have seen
the transcripts!
Telling and
showing the identity of these
individuals that
they're exposed is so vital!
I would trade two years of him
in prison to have this any day
of the week.
But there is one group of
law enforcement that we need
that's more
important than you and I,
and that is all of you.
The times that you
share a TruBlu episode,
the stories that you tell to
your friends and families,
you are the best law
enforcement tool in America.
pensive ethereal music
Maybe the appeal of a
show like this is that it's a
world of good versus evil,
and you know
what side you're on.
It's an empowering
way to live,
especially if you're a victim.
It helps you turn the tables.
And thereby, hopefully...
you can heal...
a wound.
Do you feel any
closer to understanding how...
this happens to children?
Uh, not...
I've never heard an explanation
from a predator I've caught...
that justified the action.
Not justifies it; I
don't think it's justifiable.
I mean to explain it.
Something that
helps make sense of it.
It never makes sense to me; I
can't get my arms around it.
And I think that's why we
have such a difficult time in
society...
dealing with this issue.
- We want simple solutions
- - lock 'em up forever,
give 'em the pill that
stops them from doing this,
or, uh, get 'em in the
appropriate therapy.
But there are different guys.
You have some hardcore
predators who would be doing
this with or
without the internet.
And then, you've got the young
opportunists -- early 20s,
have a hard time socializing
with other men or women.
And I think the third group of
men are guys who wouldn't be
offending without the
internet -- the 24/7 access,
the anonymity, and the
addictive nature of this.
To play
Devil's Advocate, though,
you described three very
different kinds of predators.
Absolutely.
All of
whom, on your show,
will face the same
kind of punishment.
As they should!
I mean, the law is
the law in these cases.
Right, but legal
punishment isn't the only kind
of punishment here.
You and Shawn were having a
disagreement about one of the
recent episodes of
the show that you did
with Hunter, the 18 year old.
It really wasn't so
much a disagreement,
when it came to the 18-year-old
caught in this investigation.
Ultimately, we
agreed and decided to...
take the episode down
because he had entered
into a...
you know, sort of a...
an agreement with the court
that if he didn't reoffend,
his record would
be wiped clean.
And so, the decision was made
to give him a second chance in
terms of his exposure, and I'm
comfortable in that decision.
I think the issue that
if you Google this kid's name,
it's the first five
pages of the internet
because of the show.
So there's no
wiping of that record.
That's, in a sense, permanent.
Permanent for now.
It goes away.
Some people watching
this may feel like you have
something to answer for --
that this genre of TV you've
helped make doesn't deter
criminals, or get to the
bottom of their crimes,
it just helps us enjoy it.
And I make documentaries too,
so I'm not just coming after
you here.
But we make TV, and we
point cameras at something,
and the trauma continues.
What do you say to that?
I understand your point.
And it's a valid point.
But...
you don't know how many times
someone has come up to me --
at a store,
at a restaurant,
on the street --
and said to me,
"Thank you for what you do.
I was victimized by an
adult when I was a child --
traumatized in
a way that has...
forced me to be in
therapy to this very day.
And every time you
confront a predator,
it makes me feel better."
I understand people saying,
"You push it too far.
You...
take a man at his worst,
and you put
him on television.
You shame him."
I'm okay with that;
I'll take that criticism.
But for every human being who
comes up to me to tell me their
story about being a survivor,
this particular investigative
franchise is for them.
And I'm okay with that.
And if that's my legacy,
very comfortable.
I'm a survivor.
I was seven years old.
And...
I didn't realize it
as a young adult,
but one of the reasons that I
watched your show was for that
moment,
when you sit down with these
men and you ask them
why they're here.
What could bring
them to do this?
And it took me a long time
to realize that that's what I
wanted from your show.
In many ways, you are who...
we do this for.
I had no idea,
getting into this,
what it would become,
the impact it would have.
And it sends a message that we
will stand up for the survivor.
And that is a big part of what
we do in this particular series
of investigations.
Chris, you're
obviously free to go.
You're free to--
"What happens next?"
"That's not up to me."
- Guys, thank you!
- Thank you.
Appreciate it.
Great work, guys.
Thank you.
Nice to see ya.
Here's our pretend kitchen.
pensive ethereal music
That's a cut for A and B.
David, you good?
You get everything you want?
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