01x13 - Father and Son Payback

[bunniefuu]

-This is your son?
-Yes, ma'am.

You gave him a truck?

I told him,
I would give him that truck,

till you get a job,
get back and forth.

I get a call saying
my truck had been abandoned

on the side of the road.

Is that the way it happened?

Well, it's something
like that, ma'am.

[Judy chuckles] Does it look...

does it look like I believe him?

[narrator]
This is Judy Justice.

[theme music]

James Stewart II
is suing his son,

James Stewart III,
for tow and impound fees,

traffic tickets, and toll charges.

[Kevin] Court, come to order.
All rise.

Be seated, please.

-[Kevin] Hello, Judge.
-Good morning.

Case number 1045.
Stewart versus Stewart.

-Thank you.
-You're welcome.

Mr. Stewart, this is your son?

Yes, ma'am.

[Judy] How old is he?

He's 32.

[Judy] Your claim
is that he owes you

certain parking fines,

traffic tickets,
impound fees for a truck

that you either gave him,
or he borrowed.

What I gather
from your complaint is,

you became aware that there was
a warrant outstanding

for your son's arrest.

Uh, yes, ma'am.

[Judy] When did that occur?

On the first of June of 2020,
uh, I had a City Marshal

from the North Richland Hills
Police Department

knock on my door looking
for my son, stating that...

[Judy] Don't tell me what he said.

Are you aware that there was
an outstanding warrant

for your arrest, Mr. Stewart?

Uh, not until that time.

[Judy] Okay. Did you become aware,
subsequently,

-what that warrant was for?
-Yes, ma'am.

What was it for?

Traffic tickets.

[Judy] What kind of traffic tickets?

[James III] No insurance.

No insurance on wha... [chuckles],

no insurance on what?

On the previous vehicle.
Not the...

on the previous vehicle
that I'd owned, uh...

-[Judy] Okay. Okay, Mr. Stewart.
-This was a few years ago.

So, you say that there
was a no-insurance ticket.

-One or more than one?
-Just one.

[Judy]
Now, I'd like you to tell me,

since you say it was
a couple of years ago,

I'd like you to tell me

what the specific circumstances
were of no insurance,

because, you know,
as a thinking person,

I'm driving along,
and for no reason,

a police car pulls me over and says,

I'd like to see
your insurance card.

Now, I've lived
seven-plus decades.

[James III] Yes, ma'am.

I've been driving
six-plus decades.

That's never happened to me.

Ever been pulled over
for an insurance card?

No, ma'am.

Ever been pulled over
for an insurance card?

No.

Kevin?

No.

Hundred years here
of driving.

-[James III] Right.
-[Kevin chuckles]

[Judy] So, you want to tell me
the circumstances how,

somehow, your car
was pulled over

for a lack of an insurance card?

I didn't have my insurance card
on me at the time.

And because I didn't have it, they,
um, I was cited for it.

No, no, no, no.

They pulled you over
for something.

What did they pull you over for?

Uh, I think at the time,
it was for...

[Judy] No, no, think hard.

The questions
are going to get harder.

-[James III] Yes, ma'am.
-Mr. Stewart...

-Yes, ma'am.
-[Judy] I'm one of those people

that you can't get over.

-[James III] Yes, ma'am.
-Got it?

-Yes, ma'am.
-[Judy] All right.

So, what were you
pulled over for?

Not signaling at a red light.

[Judy] Oh, well,
that's pretty benign.

Not signaling on a red light.
Was that ticket dismissed?

Uh, no, ma'am. It was not.

Okay. Now, at the time
that you had no insurance,

did you have a driver's license?

Yes, ma'am.

[Judy] A valid driver's license?

Yes, ma'am.

[Judy] Did you only get one ticket?

Uh, yes, ma'am.
Just for the no insurance.

[Judy] Did you subsequently
get insurance?

Yes, ma'am.
After that, I did.

[Judy] With what company?

[James III] GEICO.

[Judy] And what kind of car
was that?

Uh, a 1997 Ford F150.

Oh, that's the same year
of the... the car.

Does it look like
I'm having trouble with him?

-[James II] Uh...
-I'm enjoying myself.

Oh, okay. Okay.

Now, that's the same year
and make of car

that's in question.
So, you had a truck,

just like your father
gave you before?

Similar. Yes, ma'am.

[Judy] Not similar, same year.

Same year, same make.

-[Judy] Same year...
-Same model.

[Judy] Same make, same model.
What... [laughs],

Mr. Stewart, does it look...
does it look like I believe him?

-Uh, no, ma'am.
-[Judy] Look at this.

Does it look like I believe him?

He's making it up
as he's going along.

So, it's sort of joyous
for me to be able to do this.

Oh, okay.
You're the judge,

-yes, ma'am.
-[Judy] How many...

Do you have a copy
of the warrant?

Well, all I have here, Your Honor,

is what the, is what
the City Marshal left me.

May I see it, please?

And he had, uh...

Shh.

Well, how much
was the total fine

for this alleged
one ticket, sir?

Uh, I think it was close
to 1,500 dollars, ma'am.

In any event, now I know
with whom I'm dealing,

I'm going to come back to you.

So, this Marshal came to your door
looking for your son.

Your son, at that time, according to you,

wasn't living with you?

-Correct.
-[Judy] But you were aware

that this was not the first time

the Marshals came looking for him.

Uh, well, I was informed

that he had already talked
to the Marshal,

and he had made previous plans
to show up.

[Judy] No, I'm talking about

with regard to a total other matter.

Did you ever have a warrant
issued for you, sir,

for non-payment
of child support?

Uh, no, ma'am.
that's not necessarily...

What do you mean,
"not necessarily"?

Well, there wasn't
a warrant issued for my arrest.

Uh, I was in court
when I got arrested for it.

[Judy] Okay.
So you were in court.

What court were you in and when,
when you got arrested

for non-payment
of child support?

It was, uh, Family Court,

and it was in 2019.
Uh, February 2019.

Okay, now, somebody
came and arrested you

while you were
in the courthouse?

They actually made
a ruling right there,

uh, and-and arrested me
as soon as they made the ruling.

Oh, no, that-that wasn't
a warrant for your arrest, sir.

The judge found that you were
in contempt of a court order.

Yes, ma'am.

That sounds more like it.
So, you went before a judge.

The judge had given you time
to pay your child support.

You did not.

How many chances
did the judge give you

to pay your child support?

Not too many, Your Honor.

[Judy] Not too many.
More than two, or less than two?

Uh, less than two.

[Judy] No, it didn't happen.

You were told to pay
your child support,

there's no question about that.

Nobody arrests somebody
the second time

they didn't pay
their child support.

How many times
were you given a chance

to start paying
your child support?

I was actually battling
this for, it was a...

it was a two-year deal that
I battled with my ex and, uh

No, the judge had made...
not the battle with your ex.

The judge had made an order.

The judge had ruled that you're
supposed to pay this amount,

either in permanent child support,

or temporary child support.
You didn't pay it.

Judge said, "I'm going to give
you another chance to pay it."

I mean, I was in that court
for a quarter of a century.

-Yes, ma'am.
-[Judy] I know the routine.

It's a pretty set routine.

Said, come back,
pay the child support.

You didn't come back,
pay the child support.

-[Judy] You didn't...
-It was twice, Your Honor.

Two times. The first time
they gave me a warning,

the second time
they arrested me.

Oh, okay.
Well, so you got fair warning.

I guess you could say that.

[Judy] Fair warning.
Okay. So, they arrested you.

Did you spend time in jail?

-Yes, ma'am.
-[Judy] How much time?

Seven months.

[Judy]
You come from the State of...?

Texas.

Texas. They don't fool around in Texas.

-No, ma'am, they do not.
-[audience laughs]

[theme music]

'Cause what you're
asking me to believe

is that you paid off
the 19,000 dollars

in back child support.

Take a deep breath,

and say something
that we can understand.

[theme music]

[narrator] James Stewart II
claims his son,

James Stewart III,

owes for towing charges,
impound fees,

and traffic tickets he received
while driving his dad's car.

Now, how much
child support did you owe?

Uh, a little under 19,000 dollars.

[laughs]

How old is the child?

Uh, 14 now.

[Judy] And what was the amount
of the child support order

that you were supposed to pay?

It was, uh, I had to make
weekly payments of 165 dollars,

is what I think it was.

Sounds like you didn't
make a few payments

if your arrears were up to 19,000 dollars.

Well, something like that, ma'am.
Yes, ma'am.

[Judy] Hmm-mm.

[James III]
Over a period of three years,

it's just missed payments periodically

because of loss of job
or whatever reason.

Do you still owe the 19,000?

No, ma'am.

[Judy] Did you pay it?

Yes, ma'am.

Over a two-year period?

Over about two
and a half years. Yes, ma'am.

[Judy] Anybody help you
make the payments?

No, ma'am.

Was this the first time
you spent time in jail?

Yes, ma'am.

Silly, right?

Very.

How much did you owe
on the parking tickets?

Fifteen hundred?

Uh, 1,500. Yes, ma'am.

[Judy] Did you father call
and tell you

that they were looking for you?

[James III]
Yes, ma'am. He did.

[Judy] And do you remember
what day he called you?

Was it June 1st?

Uh, it-it was around
the 1st of June. Yes, ma'am.

Do you remember
the conversation

that you had with your father?

Uh, it was brief.

Well, relay it to me.

"Uh, son, they came here
looking for you

for warrants.
You need to get on paying this."

I then told him because
I was going through,

uh, a divorce, my mother
had just passed away as well.

I was also in between jobs,

having just got out
from the child support thing.

And I told him, "You know, I-I...
I'm going to get on this,

but I can't pay it until
I get a job and get money."

He then told me, uh,

"Well, we need to get this
taken care of

because I don't need them
coming by my house like this."

And we went down there

and-and he made
the initial payment.

[Judy] And how much was that?

Three hundred and
eighty-five dollars, I think.

Excuse me, Judge.
I gave him 400.

He never gave me back
my change though.

-[chuckles]
-[audience chuckles]

Well, that's your debt,
correct?

Yes, ma'am.

[Judy] Well, that still leaves
a lot of money.

That still leaves
about 1,200 dollars.

Yes, ma'am.

Did you pay it?

Uh, yes, ma'am.
Over a period of time.

[Judy] Well, I want you to think
about the answer to that again.

Did you pay the 1,200 dollars?

Yes.

Not all at once.

[Judy] I don't mean all at once.
I mean all of it.

I did, in payments, installments.
Yes, ma'am.

That was the initial agreement
with the Marshal.

I understand
what the agreement was.

My question to you is,

did you pay off
the 1,200 dollars?

Be careful of your answer,
Mr. Stewart.

Yes, ma'am. I did.

[Judy] When was your last
payment, Mr. Stewart?

[James III]
This had to have been

about 12 months ago, ma'am.

Almost a year.

I actually had a, they actually
ended up picking me up too.

And I had to sit the rest of it
out, all the-the rest.

I didn't have the,
I didn't actually have to

pay the entire 1,200 dollars.

I had to sit out the rest
of what I didn't pay, in jail.

What do you mean, you sat out?

Sat in jail, ma'am.

So, you didn't pay
the rest of the tickets?

Well, they picked me up

before I could make
my final payments. Yes, ma'am.

[Judy] Final payments.

And how much time did you
spend in jail this time?

Uh, just a few days.

[Judy] And that was for
contempt of a court order,

because you agreed to make
that an order... 385 down,

and the rest
was supposed to be paid

at a 192 dollars a month?

Yes, ma'am.

Well, you see
where I'm having trouble

with-with your story.

And then I'm going to get
to your father in a minute.

Sad father. This all
happened a year ago

when the Marshal
came to your house.

You had just gotten
out of jail,

which means
you didn't have a job.

And somehow, somehow,
you're telling me

that you managed to pay off


in back child support
in the last year

while you were not working,
according to you,

and spent a little time incarcerated

for not paying a hundred
and ninety-two dollars a month.

So, is what you're
asking me to believe

is that you paid off
the 19,000 dollars

in back child support?

[sighs]

[Judy] Take a deep breath

and say something that we,
over here, can understand.

[James III]
Before the whole incident

with me and him happened,
I did have a job.

I was, there was,
there was a six-month time there

where I got out and...

Yeah, but you can't save


-unless, you know...
-[James III] Well...

...unless you hit it
really hot in the market.

[laughs]
I understand that, ma'am.

We also, I was also making payments
on top of payments

to get the...
the back child support paid.

But you can't pay off


I didn't have to
pay it all off, ma'am,

because she waived...

she waived what I didn't
pay off, because I'd spent

the jail time
and-and everything,

I'd been seven months in jail.

[Judy] All right, Mr. Stewart, you're...

Yes, ma'am.

You know, you're probably
a loving parent,

and you keep keeping
your fingers crossed

and saying that
it'll all turn around.

But it doesn't look to me
as if it's all turning around.

Okay. Now, at the time
that he had

three hundred and eighty-five dollars
paid down payment,

and he didn't pay the rest
because he spent time in jail

for not paying the rest off,
you also gave him a truck.

Well, I-I told him

that I will give you my...
an old Ford pickup truck '97.

And that, uh, you
gotta have a horse in Texas.

You gotta have a horse, period,

if you want to get around
and survive in this world.

And I told him
I would give him that truck to,

uh, to, you know, get a job,
get back and forth.

And he-he could have the truck, get a job,

work three or four months.

Save a little money,
and take that truck,

some money, go get yourself
something better to drive.

And, uh, that's what I did.
But when we showed up

to pay the, uh, uh,
ticket to City Hall,

my son conveniently
left his wallet at home.

He told me, "Dad..."

No, he owes you
the 385 dollars.

There's no question about that.

He understands that's his fine,
and he has to pay it.

-[James II] Sure.
-We're talking about the truck.

-Yes, ma'am.
-[Judy] Okay, so now...

But I told him
he wasn't gonna leave...

the truck was not
going to leave my yard

until he got his... until he paid
the payment or down payment,

and he got that taken care of.

Well, just a second.

That's not what
you told him at all,

because the truck
did leave your yard.

And he did, in fact, have
the down payment made by you.

And he didn't pay you back

the 385 dollars.

That is correct.

[Judy] So, and you still
gave him the truck?

Well, I gave him the truck
to go get the money

because he promised me
he was going to bring it

-back to me within the hour.
-Yeah, yeah, yeah. You keep...

Mr. Stewart, make sure
you're consistent

with what you wrote
in your complaint.

And so far,
you're not being consistent

with what you wrote
in your complaint

because your complaint says
that you gave him the car,

and the condition was
that he get the car

registered in his own name
and get insurance.

That's what you said.

Yes, ma'am. I sure did.
Yes, ma'am.

Well, that's impossible

because nobody's gonna
let him register a car

with all those tickets
in his name...

no state, not even Texas.

And I realize that now, ma'am,
because,

uh, three months later,
I get, uh, a call

saying my car had been, uh,
my truck had been abandoned

on the side of the road.

[Judy] Well, just a second.
I understand that.

Your truck's been abandoned
on the side of the road.

It was still in your name, there were
impound fees that you paid...

Yes, ma'am.

[Judy] ...and certain toll fines
or other fines

that were on the truck
when he had it.

So, he had the truck
from June 2020...

Yes, ma'am.

[Judy] ...until what date did the
truck break down, Mr. Stewart?

Uh, I believe
that was in July,

at the end of July.
Yes, ma'am.

-[Judy] July of 2020.
-That's not true.

Now I'd like to see
the dates of the tickets.

[James II] Well, I got the...

No, no, let me just see it.

[James II] Find it here.

After he left in the truck
and did not come back, uh,

I-I-I didn't hear or see him

[Judy] Could I... could I just
see the dates of the tickets?

[James II] Well, I-I don't have
no tickets on the truck.

All I have, I have the dates
on the... on the,

when the truck was impounded.

No, when you...
you're suing for tickets

that you allegedly paid.

Well, I-I paid the down payment
for his payment plan,

which he was supposed to
pay me back within the hour.

-[Judy] Right.
-[James II] And he-he's the one

that got the receipt
and the change.

And I tried to get
a copy of that.

But I did notify the Marshal.

[Judy] Just a second.

I just told you the 385 dollars

in fines, he owes you.
You had other things.

What you said was,
you had to go in,

pay impound fees...

Yes, ma'am.

You got somebody
to tow it out of impound,

and then you gave it
back to him.

Well, I, you see,
well, I took it home

and it sat in my backyard
for another six weeks.

And he called me
on the phone saying,

"I'm gonna come
and get my truck."

I said, "No, you're not going
to come and get the truck

because, uh, first of all,
it's not out of my name,

and it needs a water pump.
So, it wasn't goin' anywhere."

So, but he did show up
a few days following that

with a water pump,
and he repaired it himself,

which was,
I was quite impressed,

which [clears throat],
thank God for YouTube.

And I told him, before
that truck leaves my yard,

I'm gonna see insurance on him,
which he did.

He showed me proof of insurance

where he paid through GEICO,
I believe it was,

and he was on his way
down to the courthouse

to have it transferred
out of my name into his name,

which never happened.
There again, I-I trusted him

and wanted to believe him

-and-and, uh...
-[chuckles] Okay.

[theme music]

They sent you a first notice,

-a second notice, a third notice...
-Yes, ma'am.

before it gets up to 800 dollars.

-Yes, ma'am.
-Well, why didn't you pay it?

[theme music]

[theme music]

[narrator]
Defendant James Stewart III

is accused of
not paying towing costs,

impound fees,
and toll charges he collected

while driving his dad's car.

Now, fool me once,
shame on you.

Fool me twice, shame on me.

Yes, ma'am.

[Judy] And when you deal
with children,

sometimes it's twice,
three times, four times,

five times, you know,

you-you keep hoping for miracles.

Right now, your son owes you


And his responsibility,
so far, you've had zero

except the fact
that he was able to

put in a water pump
with YouTube,

you've had zero luck
with his responsibility.

Yes, ma'am.
That's correct.

Okay, so far,
he owes you 385 dollars.

Anything else?

[James II]
Oh, yes, ma'am.

When I went to get the truck
outta impound, I, uh,

it cost me, uh, which
I have it here right here.

Here is the impound,
what it cost

to get it out of the impound
and here's what I paid to,

uh, to rent a trailer. Do you...?

And-and, and also at the time
that I went and got it,

I-I-I had a broken ankle,
and I was in a cast on foot.

So, I had to pay somebody
to go with me

to help me
to retrieve the truck,

get it on the trailer,
and bring it back to Fort Worth.

Why did you do that?

-[James II] Well...
-It wasn't running.

Well, I just felt
like I was ob...

it was still in my name,
so I felt like

I was obligated
to do that, ma'am.

Well, what you have to do is,

you had to pay the impound fees
and then tell them to junk it.

[James II] Well, I...

[Judy] Unless you wanted
to give it to him.

-Well, I... I-I thought...
-[Judy] Which you did.

when I take it back home,
he would,

he can fix it
and realize that, you know,

life goes on
when you have, when you,

when you stumble in life,
and, uh...

Yeah, that's what...

that's what you chose to do
as a father.

He owes you 385 dollars.

[James II] When, uh, I got
another matter here, ma'am,

to where he-he went...
while he was driving,

he was-he was using
the toll roads. And instead of...

That I would like to see.

If he, during the time
that he had the truck,

if he used tolls

-or had any fines...
-[James II] I have the receipt.

...that I would... that I'll see.

And I'm really not...

I don't understand the,
uh, the yellow letter there.

Uh, if I'm being sued or not, that's...

I'm not quite clear on that.

I just received, I didn't...
What address

do you live at, Mr. Stewart?

Right now, it's,
uh... Thistle Park Drive,

and that's in Fort Worth.

And what about you, sir?
Where do you live?

I live at... Smithville Road.

Well, I don't know
when these fines were from, sir.

[James II] Well, ma'am, uh...

It doesn't say.
It just says that there's

a previous balance
of 768.91 dollars

that had not been paid,
payment due August of 2021.

If you have any dates there that...

Yes, ma'am, uh,
I think these are those.

That indicate when
these tickets were from.

I don't understand this,
Mr. Stewart.

They sent you these bills

because the notices
come to you at your address.

-That's because...
-[Judy] It indicates that

they sent you a first notice,

a second notice,
a third notice.

Yes, ma'am.

A first, second and third,
and it all came to you,

didn't come to him.

Well, he-he,
when he first got out of jail,

ma'am, he had given my address
as his home address.

Well, I understand that, sir.

But-but-but yes, ma'am,
they did come to me

because the truck
was still in my name.

That's how,
that I understand.

So, when you got
the first notice

they send you notices,
you know,

before it gets up
to 800 dollars.

The first notice
that they sent you

was 43 dollars,

and a ten-dollar penalty
for late fees.

And then they sent you
a second notice the next month,

and then the late fee on that
was 25 dollars.

Yes, ma'am.
Well, why didn't you pay it?

Or contact him?

So, you weren't surprised
when you got this

for 783 dollars 'cause
you'd been getting them all along.

Well, I tried
to contact him to tell him,

"Look, keep the truck
off the tollway."

[chuckles] Okay.

Mr. Stewart, at a certain point,
fool me once...

-Right.
-Shame on you.

-[James II] Right.
-Fool me twice...

-[James II] Shame on me.
-Shame on me.

Third time, fourth time,
fifth time, six time,

up to 800 dollars.

At some point,
it becomes your burden.

He owes you 385 dollars

because that's his fine for
making a turn allegedly with...

allegedly, without
an insurance card.

Judgment for the plaintiff
in the amount of 385 dollars.

We're finished here.
Thank you.

-[Kevin] Court adjourned.
-Thank you, Judge.

[theme music]

I felt like I would,

I would love
to get-get the truck out.

It was... it was in my name.

Well, I just don't believe that I,

uh, I should be ordered
to pay something that,

when it was given to me
out as a gift, you know,

the kindness of your heart
from a father to son,

that's just my opinion.

And as far as the toll,
the-the tollway,

I mean, James might have done
the freeway at the toll, right,

okay, and, uh,
and I don't use toll roads.

It all got blew
out of proportion, if you will.

And here we are today.

Well, you know what,
I-I-I hate that.

Uh, all I have in this world
is my son and my daughter,

you know, immediate family,
and, uh, and I hate it.

If I did this for my daughters,

I wouldn't expect them
to pay it back.

But it is what it is.

And-and I hope
the sooner he realizes that,

you know, that life's full of
bumps and bruises,

then the sooner he'll,
he'll get over his dilemma

and, uh,
and he'll get on in life.

Hopefully, we can move on

and-and keep going
as a family, if we can.

It is what it is.
But hopefully, we can.

I can let it all go
because it's just money.

But I was trying...
it's all about principle.

Money's not everything, so...

[Judy] So, the question
really is,

you always keep your fingers
crossed with kids.

And the child is always
your child, even when you're 32.

But there comes a point,
I think, for every parent

where they have to acknowledge

that a child is not
really being responsible.

So, here's my question,
how many chances do you think

that your parents would give you
under that, those circumstances?

I think the lack
of responsibility is a big one

because I don't think
my parents would continue to

give me more responsibilities
like a car, insurance, payments,

after I've been clearly challenged
in the responsibility department.

So, not as many times as
that plaintiff gave his son.

You got a little latitude,

you're little younger
than that man

who has a grown child,
and clearly who's irresponsible.

But I think at some point,
every parent has to be,

aside from a loving parent,
they have to come to terms

with the fact that they have
an irresponsible child,

and if you keep feeding into it,

the child is going to continue
to be irresponsible.

I think that
that's the takeaway.

Yeah.
Parents cannot be enablers.

Right. That's the answer.

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[narrator]
Have you been cheated?

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