01x08 - Child's Stimulus Check Tug-of-War/Cleaning-Business Payback

[bunniefuu]

There was a domestic violence incident.

You mean, with the father of her child?

Correct. And that's when the baby
was put into my custody.

Stop shaking your head!

You don't take care of the baby.

I buy her clothes, I buy her...

I don't care!

[narrator]
This is Judy Justice.

[theme music playing]

Dr. Ebony Sherman is suing
her daughter's boyfriend,

Larry Riggs, for government stimulus
payments and tax credits.

[Kevin]
All rise! Court, come to order!

Be seated, everyone.

-Good morning, Judge.
-Morning.

We have case number 1026,
Sherman versus Riggs.

Thank you. Miss Sherman,
you have custody of your granddaughter.

That is correct.

How old is she now?

She's eight months.

How long has she been with you?

She's been with me
since the day she was born.

Where is her mother?

Right there.

That would be you. Was she
living with you when the baby was born?

She did. When she was
released from the hospital,

she came to stay with me
for about a month.

Then she tried to go stay on her own
in her apartment.

Some domestic violence broke out.

You mean, with the father of her child?

Correct.

And that would be the father of the child?

-Yes.
-How old is your daughter?

Twenty-five.

-Is this her first child?
-It is.

How's the baby?

She's amazing.

When the baby was born,
did the state put a social hold

on her being released to her mother?

Not initially. In December, when
there was a domestic violence incident,

they did, and that's when the baby
was put into my custody.

Was the baby living with you and
your daughter and the boyfriend?

Or were they living on their own

when this domestic violence
took place in December?

My daughter was living in an apartment,
but she has some limitations.

So, when she had the baby,
I was there to support her.

They came to stay with me,
I supported both of them.

She wanted to try to live independently.

Although I had some reservations, she
hadn't given me any reason to doubt that.

So, I... I don't want to say allowed,

but I allowed them to go
without hesitation.

But the baby will still come stay with me
about three days a week

and then go back with her mom.
But in that three-week span,

a domestic violence incident broke out.

-Between the two of them.
-Absolutely.

-And the police were called?
-Absolutely, and Children Services.

And that's when the child was removed.

That's when she was officially removed,
correct.

And when she was officially removed,
she was placed with you.

-That is correct.
-[Judy] Okay, now I got it.

And she's been with you ever since?

That is correct.
But I would like to interject that

I filed for custody of my granddaughter
ten days after she was born,

that would be when she was
released from the hospital,

because my daughter does have limitations
and the father has limitations as well.

-[Judy] Was that granted?
-That was granted.

-Is that order still in existence?
-Yes, it is.

-Do you have a copy of that order?
-I do.

I'd like to take a look at it.

Uh... Try to behave yourself.

-I'm sorry, ma'am.
-[Judy] Good.

I'm not seeing, Miss Sherman,
your name in here.

It's actually Doctor Sherman, and it...

[Judy] Dr. Sherman, I'm not
seeing your name here.

I do have the file
I downloaded on my laptop.

-I need to see them.
-Okay.

-Do you have your laptop with you?
-I do.

[inaudible]

Kevin?

Okay. For the record,
Dr. Sherman has custody of this child

pursuant to a court order.
The court order provides that

any child funds support that's received
for this child go directly to her.

That's what the case is about and
what your claim is that Mr. Riggs,

who is the child's father, who was
actually present at this hearing,

according to the document itself,

he received stimulus money for this child,

which should have gone to you.
That's your claim.

I don't know what Mr. Riggs
has to say about that,

but whatever he has to say about that,
he better say it quickly!

So, let's go directly to you,
now I've got the background of the case.

Dr. Sherman takes care of this baby...
Stop shaking your head.

Don't shake your head. You don't!
You don't take care of the baby.

How did you manage to receive
stimulus money for this child?

Your Honor...
-No, just... I've asked a question.

-I'm answering only your question, ma'am.
-[Judy] Good.

Your Honor, I had someone else
apply for taxes for me.

I told him to look into it for me
and he applied.

Who did you tell to look into it for you?

A friend. I only know him
on a nickname basis.

What's his nick-name basis?

Tony... or something. I'm sorry.

So, you asked a friend of yours
to look into the fact

that the government was
handing out free money.

Did you get a stimulus check?
For yourself?

-It came with the money...
-[Judy] Just a second.

-Yes, ma'am.
-My question is,

-did you get stimulus money for yourself?
-They camer together, yes, ma'am.

-How much?
-Fourteen hundred.

-Fourteen hundred?
-[Larry] Yeah, twice.

One for her and one for me,
they came together.

-Nothing more, nothing less.
-Just a sec.

Did you get $2,800 for yourself?

Did you get two checks for fourteen...

-No, one check. Yes.
-Just one check for $1,400.

No, no, one check for $2,800
and it went straight to my card.

Mr. Riggs, how much money,
in total, in stimulus,

did you receive from
the federal government?

-In total?
-In total...

Both times that they sent out checks.

One time was only me and
the other time was me and her.

-Just a second. One time was...
-The first one was $1,400, by myself.

-Just my name.
-[Judy] Okay.

And that's before the baby was even born.
And I used all that money.

Just a second. Fourteen hundred dollars,
you got for yourself.

-Yes, ma'am.
-Okay. And are you employed?

At the time, I had just lost my job.

So, the answer is no.
Are you working now?

Self-employed. I do dog grooming
and dog walking right now.

I get paid ten dollars an hour.

-So, not employed, you do odd jobs.
-[Larry] Yes, ma'am.

So, you got a second stimulus check.

And when you do these odd jobs,
you're paid in cash.

-Yes, ma'am.
-[Judy] Okay.

So, the second stimulus check,
after you asked your friend Tony...

[Larry] Mm-hmm.

To look into whether or not you were
entitled to money for your daughter,

-who does not live with you, found out...
-But I take care of her.

-Hmm?
-I take care of her.

I buy her clothes, I buy her...

I don't care!

Yes, ma'am.

It's not your money, period!
It's not your money!

[Larry] All her expenses,
I pay for 'cause she's mine.

I take care of her.

How much money do you give to
Dr. Sherman every week to take care...

-No, look at me!
-Yes, ma'am.

-This comes up with a number!
-I have it here.

-I have it right here.
-How much money, every week,

do you give to Dr. Sherman

-to take care of your daughter?
-[Larry] Yes, ma'am.

-How much money? Just, that's a number!
-We...

-We had an agreement...
-[Judy] No, no, no!

I don't want to hear we had an agreement.

I don't want to hear anything else.
I want a number!

-I gave her nothing because her...
-[Judy] Nothing!

That would be,
you give her zero every week.

-How much money do you g...
-[Larry] She put me on child support.

-They told me not to give it to her.
-[Judy] What?!

She put me on child support.
They told me to pay them, not her.

That's the reason why
I haven't give her nothing.

-[Judy] Just a second.
-Yes, ma'am.

'Cause I take care of everything.

I want to know how much money
you give anybody,

-including a gov...
-[Larry] I give it to my daughter.

Just... Pay attention. How much money
do you give to anyone,

or any institution, including
a governmental institution...

How much do you give to any person...
Don't give to her...

To any government institution
for your daughter?

Nothing. They want me to pay...

Bup-bup! Don't tell me what they want!
I want to hear a figure or a nothing.

-Ninety dollars a month.
-[Judy] Ninety dollars... Shh!

-Just a second. So you give n...
-[Larry] Plus eighty.

[theme music playing]

So, the two of you were
irresponsible enough to make a child

that you couldn't take care of,
and foist her upon Dr. Sherman.

If Dr. Sherman didn't take her,
if they took her away from you,

they would've put her
in a strange foster home.

[narrator]
And later today...

Mr. Vaswani, did she have
a conversation with you...

No.

Just a second.
You answered my question too fast!

-[laughs] Sorry. Sorry.
-[Judy] Which means, I don't believe you!

Because you didn't even let me
ask the question.

[theme music playing]

[narrator]
Dr. Ebony Sherman

claims her granddaughter's father,
Larry Riggs,

wrongfully collected stimulus payments
from the government.

You give $90 per month to what agency?

Child support.

And you give them this $90
from what source of funds?

I do odd jobs. I do what I can
to take care of my family.

I wave signs, I walk dogs...

You're not entitled to the stimulus money!

-You're not entitled to any stimulus money
-Ma'am...

-for this child!
-My stimulus money...

-[Judy] No! Her stimulus...
-I use my whole check

-that the government gave me
-Just a second.

to spend on everything she needed.

-Her diapers, everything.
-I don't care!

I was supposed to go to school
so I can get more money and I didn't

because I'm gonna take care
of what's mine, my kids.

-For me to, and then, for...
-You're not taking care of your kid,

-if you give... If...
-If I pay for... Why not?

All the stimulus money I got,
received that $1,400,

went to my daughter.

-There will be...
-Everything she needed

-was taken care of.
-Listen to me, there's an order!

-And... There's an order
-[Larry] Even to...

of the court that says any money
goes to Dr. Sherman.

I am going to prepare an order

that she is going
to send to the IRS,

who's sending out
all these stimulus checks.

I told her I would pay for the schooling
and she, in turn, put me on child support.

She said yes, okay, we could do that.
And when I went to go pay her,

next thing you know, I had
child support calling me,

talking about, don't give her no money,
pay us.

Listen, let me explain something
to you, Mr. Riggs.

You and your girlfriend
are not the victims here.

-Dr. Sherman...
-Every time I...

-I'm paying. I don't even have a job.
-Bup-bup!

-I want you to pay attention...
-She brags about having three jobs.

I want you to pay attention to me!

-You think you're a victim, here.
-[Larry] I'm giving my best,

-and I have nothing to show for it.
-Don't speak. Don't speak!

God gave you one mouth
and two ears for a reason.

The two of you, based upon
what a court found,

are incapable of taking...

Don't speak! Don't raise your hand!
Do nothing!

A court, and I'm not going behind that,
found that the two of you,

because the police
had to be called to your home

because there was a domestic dispute
and maybe other things as well,

found that the two of you were
not capable of taking care of an infant.

The infant would be unsafe in your care.
You were present during,

according to the document that I read,
you were present...

-Falsified...
-Don't speak! Don't speak.

Now, that would mean, to me,
that the two of you

were not terribly responsible in
creating a child that you couldn't,

physically, take care of.

Dr. Sherman has already
been through the time

when she wanted to take care of babies.

I remember, because I have
good long-term memory,

when I was Dr. Sherman's age.
And I want to tell you,

the last thing I wanted was full-time
responsibility of an eight-month-old.

Nothing... I was dancing on my own,
I napped when I wanted to,

I went to dinner when I wanted to,
I saw friends when I wanted to.

I wasn't encumbered, at her age,
by an infant.

I like my grandchildren, I went and
saw them, I patted them on the head,

I gave them some gummy bears,
sometimes a dollar or two,

and then I said to their parents,
"They're all yours."

Just a second... They're all yours.

So, the two of you were
irresponsible enough to make a child

that you couldn't take care of...

The state says you
couldn't take care of her...

and foist her upon Dr. Sherman.
Now, she could've just as easily,

if Dr. Sherman didn't take her,
if they took her away from you,

they would've put her in
a strange foster home.

You are not entitled to
that child's stimulus check.

How much money, in total...
This requires a number, Mr. Riggs...

-Fourteen hundred, ma'am.
-Fourteen hundred.

Judgment for the Plaintiff.
Thank you very much.

But wait, Judge Sheindlin.
What I am suing for is the fact that,

because he filed before me,
there were certain monies from the IRS

that I was owed on my taxes
that I am not entitled to.

That I can't help you with. You're
entitled to the stimulus money check.

But he has more... But there was
more than one stimulus and there's also...

-No.
-He said he only received one.

Can you prove to me that
he received more than one?

I don't know what... But I was
also entitled to the Child Tax Credit.

I work, he doesn't...

Let me explain something to you. He...
Put your paper down!

It's the proof I only got the fourt...
The twenty... That's it.

-She can't prove you got any more.
-[Larry] Okay. I have the proof.

I would suggest that you
speak to your accountant

and take care of all of this business
in the future.

Right now, what you're getting from him
is $1,400 that he had no right to keep.

-Do you understand?
-I do.

Great. Judgment for the Plaintiff.
We're done.

[Kevin]
Court adjourned.

[theme music playing]

I think she saw right through him.

Every time she asked me for anything,
I gave her the money, I gave it to her.

Everything he said was a lie. He hasn't
been taking care of this baby at all.

That baby was lucky to have a grandmother
that was responsible enough

to take, to take her in,
in her time of need,

to make sure she wasn't neglected.

That's true. Over 40 years I've seen
that people who were irresponsible

and having children that
they're not able to physically

or financially or emotionally
take care of,

those children usually
wind up in a system

that is not as welcoming
as Dr. Sherman.

She was lucky, you know.
Irresponsible people should not have kids.

-[Sarah] Mm.
-Until they're responsible.

Case number 1019, Scott versus Keller.
Please step forward.

[narrator]
Mary Scott is suing her former employee,

Cherrie Keller, for an unpaid car loan.

Ms. Scott, you have a cleaning business?

Well, we recently sold it, but we did.

Okay, who's the "we"?

My husband and I.

How long did you have the business?

About 20 years.

Name of the business?

It was Maryland Cleaning Services.

Did you have full time employees,
part time employees?

-Both.
-What was the Defendant?

She was a part time
independent contractor.

[chuckles] Ms. Scott,
there is no such thing

as a part time independent contractor.
That's just sort of a tax thing.

-[laughs]
-Okay.

Okay? And if you had a business
for 20 years, you know that.

Which means, you didn't pay
medical insurance for her?

-Correct.
-[Judy] Right?

Did you pay her in check or cash?

-Cash.
-So, you paid her in cash.

Did she work for you five days a week?

It varied.

Was it mostly five days a week?

Yes, I'd say yes.

Was it mostly five days a week?

When I was pregnant, yes.

What does that mean,
when you were pregnant?

After I was pregnant, my hours,
they went to, like, three days a week.

Okay. How long did you work
at five days a week?

Probably about almost a year.

Okay, and how much were you paid daily?

It was per job.

Explain that to me, per job.

It depended on, like, the houses
that we had to clean.

So, they were, like, per hour.
So, like, you would clean, like,

a house for, like, one or two hours
and it was like $90 an hour,

but we didn't get that full $90. So...

-You mean, the people who cleaned?
-[Cherrie] Yes.

Well, that's how they made their money.

They would pay the company, and then
they would pay me part... a percentage.

So, Maryland Cleaning charged
the homeowner $90 an hour.

-Correct.
-And how many women, or men,

-went to a house? Were there a team?
-One to two.

Was it most of the time
with another person?

-Yes.
-[Judy] Okay.

And how much of the $90 an hour
did your team get?

You or your team?

I was a supervisor,
so I would get 21 percent,

and then the lady I would work with,

she would get, I believe,
it was 14... or 19.

And when you were working for Ms. Scott,

-did you pay taxes for that year?
-Nope.

Did you 1099 your employees?

Yes, we did, Your Honor.

No, they did not.

[theme music playing]

I want you to understand that I don't
think this was some kind of mitzvah

that you were doing for the Defendant.
Mitzvah, parenthesis, good deed.

Because if you wanted to
do a mitzvah for her,

you would've done it
while she was pregnant. Right?

Sure.

[narrator]
Cleaning business owner Mary Scott

says her former employee, Cherrie Keller,
owes payments on a car loan.

Okay, now we're gonna move on
because I just had the lay of the land

and I understand your business.

How far into your employment

did Ms. Scott get you a car?

Okay, I worked for them for about a year
and I was... I got pregnant

and I left for, like, two months
to have the baby.

Before I was even back
is when they offered to buy me a car.

-So, you had worked there for a year.
-Uh-huh.

And so, evidently, you were excited
and happy with her performance

if you were taking her back
after her maternity leave.

-Yeah.
-That's clear,

you don't even have to
answer that question.

I want you to tell me your version
of how it came about

that you either gave her money,
or purchased a car.

-That's in her name?
-[Mary] Yes.

After she came back from maternity leave,
she was having trouble getting to work.

We also needed, you know, employees
be able to drive to jobs and such.

-Uh, just a second.
-[Mary] Okay.

You went over that very fast.
She didn't have a car

-before she was pregnant.
-Correct.

And she worked for you for a period
of time after she became pregnant?

-Correct.
-And...

-During that time, she didn't have a car.
-Correct.

And you didn't offer to get her a car.

You offered to get her a car after
she came back from maternity leave.

Because you not only needed her
to get to where she had to go,

you needed other employees
to get to where they had to go.

-She asked us to get her a car.
-Just a second. Great.

-[Mary] Excuse me.
-No.

Just a minute.
You have to understand, Ms. Scott,

that, you know, if they wanted somebody
really great-looking and young

with no life experiences,
they wouldn't've hired me.

-They might have. [laughs]
-No. No.

So, I understand your business.
I understand now, how it works,

I understand your accounting practices,
and I understand the common sense of,

I've got a lot of workers that I'm paying


and I have to get them to and from
their jobs.

So, it inures to my benefit
for an employee

who I know has a history with us
of a year, and was a good employee,

this could be beneficial to everybody.

So, I want you to understand that I don't
think that this was some kind of mitzvah

that you were doing for the Defendant...
Mitzvah, parenthesis, good deed...

That you were doing for her. Because
if you wanted to do a mitzvah for her,

you would've done it
while she was pregnant. Right?

-Sure.
-[Judy laughs] Of course.

So, explain to me, the car is in her name?

-Correct.
-[Cherrie] It's not.

-In whose name is it?
-It's in my boyfriend's name.

-It's in your boyfriend's name?
-Mm-hmm.

Okay, was it purchased
in your boyfriend's name?

No, they wrote a check directly
to the person who the car was from.

And why did you put it
in your boyfriend's name?

Because I couldn't personally
put it in my name.

Just a second. You know, [chuckles]
we're gonna get into that.

-I know. I know.
-[Judy] You know.

Okay, and you couldn't put this car
in your name because...

Because I've had a previous car, the car
broke down and I never took the tags back,

so I couldn't put another car in my name.
They never asked me that.

So, the only way I could actually get it
was to put it in his name.

Just for giggles, did you tell them

that you were putting it in
your boyfriend's name?

No, they never asked any questions,
they just...

Okay, so they just paid the money
to the seller of the car.

And we had to pay for the tags and
the title and everything.

-Okay, and the car is in boyfriend's name.
-Mm-hmm.

And they were taking money
out of your check.

-Correct.
-Every week or so.

-Correct.
-Was it every week?

-Every week.
-Every week. Fifty bucks,

-according to what I read here.
-Correct.

-And then you quit.
-There's more to that, but yes.

Yeah, you're gonna tell me about
this other person that you had to drive.

-Mm-hmm.
-And that she was a problem.

And she drank a little in the morning...

-It was more than a little.
-Just a sec.

Did you ever have a discussion
with Ms. Scott about that?

I had a discussion with Kamlesh.

My husband.

Is your last name Scott?

-No.
-Vaswani.

Mr. Vaswani, did she have
a conversation with you...

-No.
-[stammers] Just a second.

You answered my question too fast.

-[laughs] Sorry. Sorry.
-Which means, I don't believe you.

Because you didn't even let me
ask the question.

-I thought it was finished.
-How could it be finished?

You must have had conversations with her
over the years

-of her employment, did you not?
-Yes. Yes, I did.

Right, I said did you ever have
a conversation with her,

-and you said no.
-I'm sorry, Your Honor.

You know, this can be easy
or it can be hard,

'cause I have a feeling
that everybody here

didn't do everything
according to all the rules.

Did Miss Keller ever discuss with you
the behavior

of one of your employees
that you asked her to pick up?

Uh, no, she did not.
I was not in the office every day.

We had a manager,
and she would be discussing

whatever she wanted to discuss
with the manager.

-The manager?
-Yes.

There's an on-site manager
managing the business.

Did you ever have a conversation
with him directly?

Yes, I have a text message.

-Oh, may I see it? Oh, better!
-[Cherrie] Yes.

-Better!
-[audience chuckles]

-Okay. So, Miss Keller.
-Yes.

There's one line in this whole text
message that refers to her drinking.

-I've talk...
-Just... Everything else refers to the fact

that this other person, who I gather
was your supervisor...

No, I was the supervisor
driving the drunk lady.

Got it. There's a line here about this
other woman being drunk and,

you know, and if we got pulled over
it would be terrible,

but it appears, from this text,
my overall reading of this text,

is you got fed up with this woman
who was treating you disrespectfully.

Yes, but I've had two phone conversations
prior to that, in detail,

talking to him about the woman
who was drunk.

Okay, but the tenor of your text messages
that your direct supervisor

was disrespectful to you,
and you had worked very hard,

you worked very hard
during your pregnancy,

and you probably came back way too early.
And you say in this text,

you've been very nice to me,
I'm sorry I have to quit,

but I just can't work for someone
who's been disrespectful to me

and continues to be disrespectful to me.
Got it.

You also acknowledge, here,
that I'm gonna pay you for the car.

I was going to. I said... I did say, also,

once I found a place to live
and I got the money.

-No, Miss Keller, have you tried
-I have two kids.

telling that to [chuckles] J.P. over
at Chase. "I'm gonna pay you back.

Well, but first I have to
find a place to live,

then I have to see if I have
any extra money.

If I have any extra money,
I will repay my car loan."

I had every intention,
it just didn't work out.

It just didn't work out.
Well, that's very nice,

that could've saved me
a whole lot of time

if you said, "I owe you the money,
I'll pay you over time." Okay.

So, left on the money is $2,538.
Is that correct?

Yes, Your Honor.

$2,538 is exactly what you owe.
You haven't made any payments since?

-No, I haven't had...
-$2,538, judgment for the Plaintiff.

-Thank you very much. We're done here.
-Thank you.

[Kevin]
Court adjourned.

[theme music playing]

I explained to him that she was getting
drunk and I just couldn't do it anymore.

We never heard from her. [chuckles]

Time to go separate ways.

You know what I found interesting
about that case?

The Defendant, who owed the money,

was totally comfortable
about telling the truth.

Telling the truth about the car
being in her boyfriend's name.

Totally comfortable.

And the Plaintiffs, because they were,
sort of, skimming over the rules.

You know, that she was
an independent contractor.

Not really, she was really an employee.

And I think, if I took anything away
from that rather simplistic case

was something that I've always known...

If you tell the truth,
you don't have to have a good memory.

[theme music playing]

[narrator]
Want justice?