02x124 - Widow Cries Thief!

[bunniefuu]

[Judge Judy] After your husband's death

he withdrew money from
your husband's bank account.

This is the last person on earth
that should have that money.

That's not your decision to make.

I could have a dozen people here with me
to make this claim.

You have no right to make that judgment.

I'm gonna fight this fight on my own.

I'm sorry. I'll stop.

[narrator] This is Judy Justice.

Kourtney Friend is suing
her former friend,

Joseph T. Ivan Jr.,

for stealing money from
her deceased husband's bank account.

[Bailiff] Court come to order.

All rise.

Have a seat everyone, please.

Hello, Judge.
Case 2190 Friend versus Ivan Jr.

-Thank you.
-You're welcome.

[Judge Judy] Mrs. Friend,
your husband passed away recently?

-Yes.
-When did he pass?

August 26th, 2022.

What did he pass away from?

He took his own life.

[Judge Judy] You have kids?

I have one. I have a daughter.
She's seven months old.

She was born, um, June 14th, 2022.

I'm sorry.

Thank you. [sobs]

[Judge Judy]
It is your claim that Mr. Ivan,

after your husband's death,

withdrew money from
your husband's bank account.

Was that a joint bank account
or his own bank account?

-It was under his, but we...
-[Judge Judy] So it was his name?

-Yes.
-[Judge Judy] So it was his bank account?

It was.

Did you also have a joint bank account?

Uh, we just shared that one.

Uh, I wasn't working and I'm not working.

Um, he is sole provider of our family.

[Judge Judy] So the bank account
was in his name solely?

-Yes.
-[Judge Judy] OK.

How do you know the Defendant?

We met in 2020.

Um, we worked together at Target.

And that's my husband and I,
and also the Defendant.

-[Judge Judy] So you worked there?
-Yes.

Did you become social friends?

Yes.

[Judge Judy] And at some point,

Mr. Ivan says that
your husband needed money,

that he was in some sort of
difficulty with rent money.

OK.

That's what Mr. Ivan says.

In what month, Mr. Ivan,

do you claim that you loaned money

to Mr. Friend?

Uh, Mr. Wayland is his name.

-[Judge Judy] Wayland.
-Yeah, Michael.

Michael and I are best friends, uh,

from the day that we met by the way,
just hit it off right away.

So this gentleman would come to me

-uh, and...and vice versa.
-Just tell me. Just tell me.

The...the money we're talking about
August 17th, 2022.

[Judge Judy] And was the conversation
about the money in your house?

-Yes.
-[Judge Judy] In your house?

-Yes.
-I'd like you to tell me

-what that conversation was.
-Absolutely.

Michael showed up at my door
on August 17th.

He needed money and he needed
away from the Plaintiff.

-Just a second.
-Uh-uh.

[Judge Judy] Don't tell me what he needed.

Tell me what he said to you.

His rent is very far behind
and he would like to borrow $1,500.

Did you ask him why?

-Of course.
-And what did he say?

-Rent?
-[Judge Judy] No.

Why his rent was so far behind.

Oh, uh, not exactly.

He stayed with me for the next two days
so we had a lot of conversation about it.

OK. So when he came on August 17th,

he did not stay home with his wife

and the new baby.

He stayed with you for how many days?

For two... That week.

You and your husband been
having a difficult time?

We were the last, um,

couple weeks before his ending.

And he did in fact stay out.

Did you know where he was staying?

No, um, I did not. I...

-[Judge Judy] OK, but you knew he was out.
-[Kourtney] Yes.

I had asked him to leave.

[Judge Judy] OK.

Now, his rent in his house where his wife

and his baby were... it was overdue?

Yes, Your Honor.

And he needed $1,500, according to you.
So what did you do?

I gave him the $1,500.

[Judge Judy] Mrs. Friend,
in June, July, August.

-Was your husband working?
-Yes.

-[Judge Judy] Same job?
-[Kourtney] Uh...

He was working with Burlington, so yes.

[Judge Judy] Did your husband
have any problems that you know of

with either drugs or gambling?

I didn't know at the time.

But do you know now?

Yes.

What kind of problems did he have?

Um, he, uh,

was strug...struggling with, um,
use of cocaine.

OK. So that would account for
his need for money

-and also for problems.
-[sniffs]

[Judge Judy] OK.

I'm guessing he was a young man.
Did he have any life insurance?

-He did. Yes.
-[Judge Judy] He did. How much?

Um, it was, oh my goodness,

it was... seven.

No, I'm sorry, $200,000.

Did the company pay on his life insurance?

No, because he committed suicide.

Oh, it wasn't that, it was,

he had, um, lapsed his payment.

So, um, I think his last payment was,

I believe, in May,

and he did not pay it.

So they... because of that, they did not.

-It lapsed.
-[Kourtney] Yeah.

[Judge Judy] It might not
have been effective anyway

since he took his own life.

OK. So you lent him $1,500.

And how did you repay yourself and when?

Your Honor, I'd like to point out
that she was very well aware of the fact

that he was using cocaine
for the better part of the year.

-[Judge Judy] Shh. Just a second.
-[Ivan] OK.

Mr. Ivan?

-Not necessary.
-[Ivan] OK. OK.

I repeat myself because
that was our agreement.

Michael was at my house a week later also.

He logged onto my phone because
he no longer had any belongings.

He no longer had a physical wallet
or a phone in his possession.

He lost them.

Ms. Friend had his wallet.
But I can show you that later.

For now, he's asking me
if he can put his memorized information

on my digital wallet
which I can show you now if you'd like.

-Yes.
-It's still on my phone to this day.

-[Judge Judy] His information?
-Correct.

-OK.
-With the agreement...

Shh. Just a second.

I could understand
you taking back the $1,500

because you say that was
his agreement with you

as was sort of buttressed by the fact

that he put his banking information
on the card.

But why would you transfer
any other money other than

the $1,500 out of his account?

[narrator] Kourtney Friend
claims her former friend,

Joseph T. Ivan Jr.,

wrongfully took money from
her deceased husband's bank account.

I want you to bring that up.

-Yeah.
-[Judge Judy] And Sarah,

-you're going to take a look at that.
-It's the top card, sir.

The one that says Chime.

That's my digital wallet.
My personal digital wallet.

So it's the same as when
you put something in your Apple wallet

and you can pay using...

I'm trying to think of the easiest way
to describe this to you.

If you log in to check your bank balance,

you can save the card to your phone.

So it makes it easier
to pay with your phone.

So it looks as if Mr. Friend logged in...

-Logged in.
-...to the Defendant's phone

with his credentials and information

-So that he...
-There was also latest transactions.

The very last transaction
was from... 10/1/22.

-And how much was that for?
-$80 at a market.

-Then there's some gas stations.
-[Judge Judy] That's for October.

-[Sarah] Mm-hmm.
-[Judge Judy] Prior to that?

[Sarah] There's a list of
just latest transactions that...

That's all the tra...
Those are the total transactions.

-[Sarah] Yeah.
-[Judge Judy] That you made?

-[Ivan] Well...
-Just a second.

There's an $80 transaction
according to Sarah in October.

-Yes, Ma'am. So the way that...
-[Judge Judy] Was that your transaction?

-It was.
-[Judge Judy] OK.

-I have...
-[Judge Judy] Shh. Just...

-I'm sure they'll match with what...
-[Ivan] $236 worth of charges.

I charged $236 worth of cash.

-From my husband's passing till...
-Hold on. Hold, hold, hold, hold.

Well, I have $80 in October.

But in transfer to... Who is that?

-That is the...
-[Judge Judy] $1,400.

[Ivan] That is the deceased.

Who transferred that?

I transferred it.
That is a GoFundMe account.

And we'll get to this, the check...

The check that came through
after he passed away

hit my phone because
he loaded his card onto my phone.

The agreement was that I pay myself back
when he was still alive.

-With the funds that are on that phone.
-[Judge Judy] Just a second.

The remaining I sent
to a GoFundMe account.

Why did you do that?

Just a second.

I can almost understand, Mr. Ivan.

-Yeah.
-Because what your position is,

and I actually believe that it's accurate

-that your friend came to you...
-[Ivan] A 100%.

Shh.

That your friend came to you
in need of money.

That he and his wife
were having difficulty.

That he had an addiction problem.

That he probably spent the rent money
on his addiction problem.

All of that sort of makes sense.

And even though resorting to self-help

after he passed, I would frown on.

I would say, this is a debt
that's owed by his estate.

And I could understand you
who had access to his account

taking back the $1,500

because you say that was
his agreement with you,

as was sort of buttressed by the fact

that he put his banking information...

and it's his sole banking information...
on the card.

But why would you transfer
any other money other than

the $1,500 out of his account?

Into his family's name, Your Honor,
and I can show you why.

I have transcripts
with everyone that knows us.

-I could have a dozen people here.
-Shh.

I'm sorry. I could have a dozen people
here with me to make this claim.

But this is a very sensitive situation
for a lot of people involved.

So I'm gonna fight this fight on my own
without them here.

Just a second.

They'll all tell you that
this is the last person on earth

-that should have that money.
-[Judge Judy] Just a second.

This is not about you making a judgment

or about 30 other people making...

-That's what Michael...
-[Judge Judy] Shh. Just a second.

Sir, unless you have a writing

from the deceased

that's authenticated in the same process

as would authenticate a will

you have no right to make that judgment
as to whether or not

his wife and or child...

I assume he died without a will.
Is that correct?

-Yes, that's correct.
-[Judge Judy] OK.

So under the laws of
practically every state

if you die intestate,
which means you die without a will,

there's a certain order of people
who inherit your money.

Your spouse, your children.

It goes sort of in order,
is there's a pecking order.

You have no right to amend that.

You actually don't even have a right

to repay yourself after he's dead.

You have no right to do that.

But I can actually understand

your sense that...

unless you paid yourself,
you weren't gonna get your money back.

I can understand that.

But whatever your intentions were, sir,

you have no right to do anything else

with the money in that bank account.

-May I?
-Am I making myself clear?

I hope so. Is that clear?

-Yes?
-[Sarah] Brought me right back

-to wills, trusts, and estates, so yeah.
-Yeah. Right. Go ahead.

Your Honor,
Michael and I had an agreement.

-OK? So whether or not...
-[Judge Judy] Shh. Just a second.

You and Michael had an agreement

that you made a loan to him
in the amount of $1,500

and in order to secure your repayment,

-I've read your answer, sir.
-Yeah.

He gave you his account number
and according to you, he said,

"When I get paid
you can take the money back

that you loaned me." That's $1,500.

May I continue?

-I've only used $236.00.
-[laughs]

[Ivan] That's all that I've used. $236.00.

And I can show you the math here
on this spreadsheet.

But it start... Let's start with $1,500,

$845 he paid back to me on August 24th
a week later.

[Judge Judy] Oh OK.
Hold, hold on a second.

-$1,500.
-That's right.

-[Judge Judy] And he paid you back what?
-$845 on August 24th.

-[Judge Judy] Good for him.
-Right.

Did he pay you back by,

by... Michael, Just listen to me.

Don't play.

Did he pay you back by coming to
your house and giving you the money or...

-Digitally...
-Shh!

-[Judge Judy] He paid you back digitally.
-That's right.

[Judge Judy] May I see that please, Kevin?

-Using my phone in his account...
-[Judge Judy] Shh!

-So now he owes you $655.
-[Ivan] That's Right.

[Judge Judy] OK.

Kevin, I'd like you to
show this to the Plaintiff.

-Have you seen this?
-No.

OK. I'd like you to show
this to the Plaintiff.

So Mr. Ivan acknowledges

that your husband...

-Mrs. Friend, pay attention.
-Yes.

[Judge Judy]
That's your husband paid him back

more than half of what he had borrowed.

Now.

Then...

you took back, Mr. Ivan, from the account

how much money?

Two hundred and thirty six dollars.

No, that's not true.

[Judge Judy] Shh.

-We can go line by line.
-Shh.

That's a debit, not a credit.

-He sent the $1,400.
-[Judge Judy] Michael to the GoFundme.

Oh yo, shh. Just a second.
You can't do that, sir.

I have a baby!

Listen to me.

You were there, you provided a shelter

-for Michael...
-To get away from her.

-[Kourtney cries]
-That's right.

-I'm sorry. I'll stop.
-[cries]

[narrator] Kourtney Friend
has accused her former friend,

Joseph T. Ivan Jr., of stealing money

from her deceased husband's bank account.

Which of these charges?

There's an $80 charge.

A $60.

Are those your charges?

-Yes.
-[Judge Judy] OK. Hold on.

-One forty.
-[Judge Judy] Just a second.

-One forty five.
-Yes.

-[Judge Judy] A $77.35.
-Yes. And that's it.

Those four.

What about a Cash app?

That's the digital transaction
that you just had.

Oh, and $845. Got it.

-I'm still owed $392.
-[Judge Judy] Shh!

OK. Now,

how much money do you allege,

and I'm gonna give this to you
or give you...

you must have this...
how much money do you allege

that he took out of the account?

I'm, um, asking for $2,700.

I don't care what you're asking for.

That's irrelevant to me
what you're asking for.

[Kourtney] OK.

[Judge Judy] How much money do you
allege he took out of the account?

I think he took way more
than what he's saying.

[Judge Judy]
Oh, well, I don't care what you think.

-He... well, it's proof right there.
-[Judge Judy] I don't. I don't.

Other than the $1,400,

which he says he transferred
to the GoFundMe page,

did you receive for your daughter

any part of this $1,400
that came from a GoFundMe page?

I have not. No.

-I...
-[Judge Judy] OK.

-Can... OK.
-Just a second.

But the GoFundMe page

was subsequent

to your husband's death, is that right?

-Yes.
-Who started the GoFundMe page?

It was my husband's.

So this money did not
belong to your husband.

This money was not money
from your husband.

This money was started by somebody else,

not the Defendant, and somehow

ended up in your husband's bank account.

Am I getting that right?

-No.
-[Judge Judy] Well, what's this $1,400?

-How did it end up...?
-[Ivan] I transferred it from...

That's Michael's bank account ledger.
It's attached to my digital wallet.

I understand...

[Ivan] It's going to the GoFundMe.

A GoFundMe is a special account
that's set up in a, in a tragic...

I...I know exactly what it is
but what I'm not following is

-why would it not be in his...?
-It is.

He's saying that that
is a "To", not a "Receiving".

-That's a debit, not a credit.
-He sent the $1,400...

[Judge Judy] ...dollars to the Go...

Oh, yo. Shh. Just a second.
Oh, you can't do that.

Sorry, sir. You can't do that.

So you took out money
that didn't belong to you

because at best case scenario,

-you're still owed $400.
-$392.

Yeah. OK. $400.

You were still owed $400

and you withdrew $1,400

of Michael's money

and sent it to the GoFundMe page.

Yeah. Because of the fact
that the last person on earth

that Michael would want to have that money
is this person right here.

[Judge Judy]
That's not your judgment to make, sir.

-[Ivan] That's fine. That's...
-[Judge Judy] Just a sec.

That's...that's not. Listen to me.

I've tried to explain to you.

-I tried to explain to you...
-OK.

...what the laws of intestacy are

in this country.

If you die without a will,

there are certain people
who get your money.

Whether the deceased hates them,

wasn't talking to them,

it doesn't make any difference.

Unless he and his wife are separated

by a lawful separation order by the court,

she and his daughter
are entitled to this money.

And it's not up to his best friend
or his best friend's friends

or other people to say,
he was angry with her,

she threw him out...

Whatever the reason that you're saying

Michael would want the last person to
receive any money from this GoFundMe page

is the Plaintiff...

that's not your decision to make.

You took back some of your own money.
He paid you back some.

You may get skunked for $400.

-I don't want it...
-Just a second.

You may get...
you may get skunked for $400,

but if you sent this money
to a GoFundMe page and that was $1,400...

[Ivan]
For the family's name, Your Honor.

You can't do that!

-That's fine. I came...
-[Judge Judy] You can't.

Michael would not want her to have it,
so I gave it to his family.

[Judge Judy]
OK. Well, you can't do that, sir.

-I have a baby.
-[Judge Judy] Unless... Shh.

I'm not faulting you emotionally, sir.

-Yeah.
-[Judge Judy] Listen to me.

You were there.

You provided a shelter for Michael...

To get away from her.

-That's right.
-[drops pencil]

-[cries]
-[Ivan] I'm sorry. I'll stop.

That's, that's a fact.
It's just the truth.

Judgment for the Plaintiff
in the amount of $1,400.

-We have finished.
-[Bailiff] This Court is adjourned.

It doesn't matter.
The woman's a fraud. She's a fraud.

Um, that money should not be going to her.

She's the last person on earth that
this gentleman wanted to have that money.

I'm happy.

I'm happy that she sided with me,

listened to me, and...

Well, that's all she cares about is money.
That's what this is all about.

She knew that that was not right,

because it... that's not.
I mean,

what kind of person would...

Kourtney's out for money,
always was in the relationship.

Take money from a...

a new mom as someone who's grieving.

It's just... it's been such a mess,
and I feel good about this.

Because I'm the only one who would
do the right thing with it.

-And he knew that.
-He was very defensive.

He was very defensive and very hateful.

I'm a great guy.
He'd want me to fight the good fight.

All Good.

He shouldn't have took anything from me.

He's already...

I've already lost so much.

Happy it's over.

I've lost my best friend,
my husband, the love of my life,

and the father of our new child.

Um, just, it's not OK.

He too... he caught me in
a very vulnerable... vulnerable state.

That case for as tragic as it was,
and I really felt for the Plaintiff,

brought me right back
to wills, trusts, and estates

and the basic, you know, three rules,

"age of majority," "of sound mind,"
and "a writing."

And it's just really unfortunate that

the Plaintiff's husband didn't have one.

[Judge Judy] You know,
if I were to venture a guess,

I would say that most people,

when they're under 40, don't have a will.

Yeah.

He was a new father.

You know, baby.

Makes it all that much more important.

Yeah it does.

But he was a new father
with a cocaine addiction.

Tough to try and guess the mental state
of someone going through that.

But I... I also agree with you
that you can't fault

the Defendant for his emotional...
He knew how his friend felt,

and he was trying to
carry out those wishes.

But there is the law and there are rules.

-Right.
-And you can't take it upon yourself

-to redistribute your friend's money.
-Money.

Or... or the GoFundMe money.

-Yes.
-Yeah.

All good intentions,
but you gotta follow the rules.

Right.

[narrator] Want justice?