03x27 - Twin Tales of as*ault and Retribution

[bunniefuu]

You got out of the car
and he punched you.

Absolutely.

He proceeded to keep pounding on me,
pounding on me.

There is no indication here, from you,

to the police that he ever
put his hands on you.

He beat me up.

Be careful. I've been doing this
for 50 years. Do you understand?

[announcer]
This is Judy Justice.

[theme music playing]

Lucretia Gaines is suing
her ex-brother-in-law,

Dwight Francis, for as*ault
and a false arrest.

[bailiff]
Court, come to order. All rise.

Have a seat, please.

Hello, Judge. Case 3030,
Gaines vs. Francis.

-Thank you.
-You're welcome.

Miss Gaines, who is this?

My witness. My twin sister,
Lucinda Gaines.

Mm-hmm. And your sister is married,

but in the process of
divorcing the Defendant.

Actually, they're already divorced.

[Judy]
When were you divorced?

August 18, 2022.

Okay. The events surrounding this case
happened in November of 2020.

Yes.

[Judy] Each one of you claim that
they were assaulted by the other.

In November of 2020, your sister
and the Defendant

were having trouble in their marriage.
Would that be a fair statement?

Yes.

[Judy] And your sister
had complained previously to you

that the Defendant was
trying to get her in trouble,

alleging that she assaulted him.

Absolutely.

So, on November the eighth,
you receive a call from your sister.

No, we was already on the phone,
Your Honor.

[Judy] So, you were on the phone
with your sister.

[Lucretia]
Yes.

I want you to relay the conversation that
you had with your sister on that date.

Well, we were just sitting there chatting,
like we always do.

We were just laughing, talking.
Talking about her schoolwork.

I was talking about my schoolwork.
We both had tests coming up.

So, we were just really into each other
in that manner that we do every day.

Okay, let's go. Move it along.

Anyway, all of a sudden, I heard, after
an hour of talking to her on the phone,

I overheard him say, "Let's fight.
Let's do this without the cops."

And I was like...

You heard him say "Let's fight."

Let's do this without the cops.
We could fight right now.

Just a second. I want to be very clear
because Whitney is taking...

-"Let's do this without..."
-[Lucretia] "The police."

"The police." That, you remember.

-That I remember.
-[Judy] Shh. Don't speak.

"Let's do this without the police." And
what's the next thing you heard him say?

They just started arguing, so...

Just a second. Would you go back,
Whitney, please,

and tell me what the Plaintiff said.
She said that he said two things.

It's, "Let's fight. Let's do this
without the cops."

[Judy]
"Let's fight."

-[Lucretia] Saying that to my sister.
-Shh!

"Let's fight. Let's do this
without the cops."

Which one was it?

You said, "Let's do this
without the police." That's one.

Or "Let's fight. Let's do this
without the cops." Which one did you...

I overheard him say both things
to my sister.

And I just hung up after that.

[Judy]
What both things?

He said... I had no idea he was there.

I said, "Cinda, who's that?"
She said, "Dwight." I said,

"Why, what's going on?"
And then, I just hung...

"What's going on?"

Yeah. And I just hung up.
I said "Okay, I'm just gonna hang up."

Why?

Because they was husband and wife.
You know, maybe it was just something

they was just going through.
I didn't know.

Let me explain something to you.
I'm beginning to suspect

what you're telling me
is a whole lot of "who shot John?"

You were on the phone with your sister.
You were talking about tests.

Like you're talking about every day.
Blah, blah, blah. Then,

you hear something
that would cause me concern.

You hear, "Let's fight. Let's do this
without the police."

And, according to you, what you said
to me was, so, I just hung up.

I said, "Cinda, I'm gonna hang up and
I'm gonna call you back."

She was like, "Oh, I'm gonna handle this."

Just a second. Don't speak!

Let's go through it again because
now we're getting a different story.

"Let's do this. Let's do this
without the cops."

And, then, what did you say to her
and what did she say to you?

I asked her who was that
in the background.

You said, "Who was that in the
background?"

And she said, "Dwight." I said, "Oh,
I thought he didn't be there anymore."

[Judy]
Okay.

And she was like, "I'm gonna handle it.
I'm gonna just call you back."

So, I said, "Okay."

Okay. She said, "Oh, I'm gonna handle it,
I'll call you back."

So, you didn't just hang up.
Just a second.

-You didn't just hang up.
-No, I didn't.

-You had a continued conver...
-I didn't want to hang up.

You didn't have...
You didn't just hang up.

You had a conversation with your sister
and your sister said,

"I'm gonna handle it." That's
what you said she said to you.

[Lucretia] Absolutely.
After 20 minutes, I called, I called.

So, I felt like they got into a fight.
Why I felt that way and I...

[Judy]
I don't care why... Just a second.

I don't care why you felt that way.
I don't care why you felt...

'Cause he got her arrested
on October 27, 2020 for as*ault.

I had no idea. I was calling her.

So, he had her arrested in October
for domestic violence.

Yes...

Just a... So, a month before,
he had her arrested

for domestic violence.
What happened to that case?

Do you know, Ms. Gaines?
Do you know? The answer is yes or no.

No.

[Judy]
But you know he had her arrested.

So now, we're in November. Your sister
has clearly allowed him back in the house.

Right? She didn't say, "It's Dwight,
he doesn't belong here,

I'm gonna call the police."
Because, according to you,

she's having a pleasant conversation
with you.

And he's talking. "Who is that?"
"Dwight. Oh, he's here."

-So, you went to your sister's house.
-Mm-hmm.

[Judy] You didn't call the police
because you were worried.

You went over to your sister's house.
Now, I want you to tell me

exactly what happened. Be careful.
'Cause, you know,

I've been doing this for 50 years.

-Do you understand?
-Yes.

[Judy] What you're about to tell me,
I've heard a hundred times.

All different kinds of versions.
But certain things make sense

and certain things don't.
Do you understand?

When I called the police...

I thought the police would be there
by the time I got there

-because my sister told me...
-[Judy] She told you what?

She told me she was gonna go to jail.
And, uh, and, uh...

I don't want to...

We're getting a lot more
into this conversation now.

Hold on. First we started with,
I hung up.

And then you said, my sister says to me...
When did she say...

-When I called back, she said...
-[Judy] Just a second.

So, you call back and you got her
on the phone.

-[Lucretia] I said...
-Oh...

Your knuckles on both hands
were cut up.

Mm-hmm.

That's not a defensive wound.

-[Lucretia] Those are.
-[Judy] No, no.

No, dear, no, dear.
That's not a defensive wound.

This is a defensive wound.
This is from hitting somebody.

[theme music playing]

[announcer] Lucretia Gaines
claims her ex-brother-in-law,

Dwight Francis, assaulted her
and lied to the police.

Dwight is countersuing, claiming he
defended himself from Lucretia's attack.

So, you waited 20 minutes
and you called her back.

Yes.

And you did, in fact,
get her on the phone.

-[Lucretia] Yes, and...
-[Judy] Just a second.

Now, I want you to go back
to what she told me four minutes ago

-with I called, I called...
-I did.

-[Judy] ...and she didn't answer.
-She did not answer.

"After 20 minutes, I stay home.
After 20 minutes, I called, I called.

I felt they got into a fight.
Why I felt that way,

because he had her arrested. Uh, I was..."

Okay. You called and called and called.
So now...

I was already halfway there,
she answered the phone.

-You called and she answered.
-Yes.

[Judy] Now, I want you to tell me
about that conversation.

Before you went over there.
I said to her, and she said to me.

-Let's go.
-I'm going to jail.

She said, "Well, I'm going to jail now
because he called the cops."

And then I said, "Okay, well,
I'm gonna just..." 'cause I felt like

she was gonna go to jail
'cause she got arrested.

Anyway, I was only going
to get my nephew...

You called her and she said,
"I'm gonna go to jail"

because he called the cops,

because he had a restraining order
against her.

-Protective order.
-[Judy] Right.

Clearly, something happened
in that 20 minutes

between the time you were talking
about your tests

and the time you got her
back on the phone that suggested to you

that something had transpired
when she said, "Now I'm gonna go to jail."

So, you went over there because
you knew about the protective order

'cause you knew she'd gotten arrested
in October.

So, now, you go over there
to do what?

To grab my nephew
because the last time I went

when she couldn't go back to her home
that he moved in with her.

He didn't even feed my nephew.
And that's what I was afraid of...

-Just a second. Is that their child?
-[Lucretia] No.

-You went over there to get your nephew.
-Yeah.

Now, what happened when you got there?

When I got there...

Slowly. Because right now
you see it doesn't go well...

-I know.
-[Judy] You understand.

Understood.

So, now, you go over there.

When I got to their home,
the Defendant was standing outside.

I finally pulled up, I saw no cops.

So, I asked him, "Why you
keep calling the cops on my sister?"

That's when he took it upon himself
to hit me in my face

and knock me off the curb, because
I guess it needed to fit his narrative.

Come to find out,
he called the cops and told the cops

that my sister called me over there
to fight him.

Why would I fight for my sister?
I shouldn't have went over there,

but I did because I was worried
about my nephew.

She told me to. She asked me
to get him the last time.

She was like, "Can you go to the house
and grab my nephew?"

You left that out five minutes ago.

Sorry. 'Cause it was so much and
it's been so long ago.

Well, that's why you're supposed to bring
a case as soon as you can after the event.

The reason I assume you didn't is
because COVID struck

and they didn't dismiss both of your cases
until recently.

So, neither one of you could've come
to civil court.

I assume that's why you waited two years.
I really don't care.

Now, that's what you say happened.
That you came over there

and got out of the car and
calmly said to him,

"Why do you keep calling the cops
on my sister?"

[Lucretia]
Yes.

[Judy]
That's what you remember you said to him.

-Yes.
-[Judy] Calmly.

Not really calmly. Really agitated
'cause I was home doing my own thing,

you know, and it was just...

I want you to tell me what happened.
You got out of the car.

Clearly, you're bigger than he is.
So is your sister.

You got out of the car,
and now you're agitated.

So, you didn't just ask him.

You said, "Why do you keep calling the
cops on my sister?"

-And he punched you.
-Yes.

[Judy]
Okay. Now...

[Lucretia]
And knocked me off the curb.

I was stuck under the car where
he proceeded to keep pounding on me.

In my head and...
I almost lost consciousness,

which I did lose consciousness.
My hands was all cut up,

I have proof, from trying to cover
the blows, but I had nowhere to move...

[Judy]
Just a second.

What part of your hand was all cut up?

Both of my hands
because I was trying to hold...

Just a second. Your knuckles
on both hands were cut up.

Mm-hmm.

That's not a defensive wound.

Those are.

That's not... No, dear, no, dear.
That's not a defensive wound.

This is a defensive wound.
This is from hitting somebody.

But I'm trying to grab my hoodie down
so he could stop punching me in my face.

That's what was happening,
because I was trying to protect my face.

I still don't understand why...
I don't know.

I don't know, but you're gonna show me.
I'm gonna look at all your proof.

I'm just examining you first
since there are cross-complaints here.

-You're trying to speak over me.
-[Lucretia] Sorry.

Clearly, clearly, you're not intimidated
by your surroundings.

That's her version of the events.
She came over to the house

and she asked you why
you keep calling the cops on my sister.

And you punched her and kept punching her
until she almost lost consciousness.

Now, you want to tell me your version
of these events?

-Okay.
-How long had you been

in the apartment with her sister?

Six or seven years.

[Judy]
No. You had her arrested in October.

So clearly, she was arrested and
out of the house. Is it your house?

No, her house.

She was not out of the house.

So, she was arrested and you both
still living in the house together?

Yes, Your Honor.

-Okay. Since October...
-[Dwight] Yes, Your Honor.

So, you were there and she was there.

Same way, Your Honor.

[Judy]
Same way. She was released by the police

and you were there, she was there,
and her son.

-Yes, Your Honor.
-Is that correct?

Yes, it's partial...

-[Judy] Don't speak!
-Okay.

So, when you said,
"What's Dwight doing there?"

you clearly didn't know
that they were still living together.

No.

So, now, you tell me your version
of the events of November 8, 2020.

-Tell me what happened with...
-[Dwight] Okay.

Lucinda was keep coming at me.

[Judy]
How did she keep coming at you?

Like, coming up in my face
like she wanted to fight with me.

And I never want to fight at all.

That is not true.

If you say one more word,
I'm gonna throw you out.

-Do you understand?
-[Lucretia] That was her.

Oh, you're easy. You're gonna be gone.

Did you call the police?

[Dwight]
Yes, Your Honor.

[Judy] Okay. Did you call the police
before Ms. Gaines got there?

Yes, Your Honor.

Okay. So, now, you've called the police.
And clearly, she heard it.

[Dwight]
Yes, Your Honor.

And she said to you,
"I'm gonna get arrested."

That's what you said.

Because it was a...

Did you say something?

There is no indication here
from you to the police

or any other authority

that he ever put his hands on you.
What you complain about,

about him is that he's disrespectful,
he taunts you,

he says nasty things to you,
he calls you names.

-[Lucinda] Yes.
-In response to that,

you as*ault him.

[theme music playing]

[announcer] Lucretia Gaines
has accused her ex-brother-in-law

Dwight Francis, of assaulting her
and lying to the police.

Dwight is countersuing Lucretia,
claiming she assaulted him.

So, you called the police
and you went outside.

I went outside first,
before I called the police.

[Judy] You went outside and
called the police from outside.

-Yes, Your Honor.
-Okay. Go ahead.

When I called the police,
I stepped down to the sidewalk.

And I was there,
waiting for the police to come.

I heard a car speed come around.
Hear her yelling,

"I hope you're not calling the cops."
I said, "Of course, I'm calling the cops."

She pulled over to the side
and come up towards me,

ready to fight with me.
I never want to fight.

I turned my head around,
she was already there in front of me,

sizing me up. And I just make a mistake
and look around.

And by the time I make that mistake and
look around, she knocked me over.

-[Judy] And?
-[Dwight] I saw her about to hit me again.

When I hit her, she fall,
and I run off, try to escape.

She get back up and running me down.
I couldn't run no more,

because I was going
towards the hospital direction,

where I was going.
When she caught up with me,

the cops turn up.

Okay. May I see the police report, please?

[Lucretia]
I have one.

Well, it's practically impossible
to determine

which one of you instigated
the physical part of this altercation.

Each of you claim
that the other threw the first blow.

Listen carefully to what I'm saying.
That's what she says,

and you said that she hit you first.

So, it's impossible to determine
who hit who first.

However, the police report
is very telling.

It says, that when the police arrived,

they found you on Kensingson Street.

And you told the police...
you, you're Lucretia...

Yes.

...said Francis, that would be him,
began to walk down Kensingson Street.

So, the fight had begun, and he got up
and started to walk away

towards Chapel Street,
which is consistent with what he said.

And Lucretia said she ran after Francis
and began fighting with him

until the police arrived.
That's what the police report says.

Ma'am, I can show you. I couldn't
even run. I had a torn meniscus...

-[Judy] Just a second.
-There's no way.

I'm telling you what the police wrote
in their report that you told them.

And it's totally consistent with what
he said, that he was trying to walk away.

[Dwight]
I was running.

After he beat me up.

Listen to me. You went over there furious.

-[Lucretia] I wasn't furious.
-Oh, yeah.

Just a second.
You went over there furious.

-Absolutely not.
-[Judy] Absolutely not?

Can I tell my story, please?

Can you tell your story?
Oh, it'd be my pleasure.

I got a couple of questions to ask you
as long as you want to testify.

Okay. There is no indication here
from you to the police,

or any other authority
that he ever put his hands on you.

What you complain about,
about him is that he's disrespectful,

he taunts you, he says nasty things
to you, he calls you names.

In response to that, you as*ault him.

No, I don't. Ma'am...

Yes, she...

He had me falsely arrested.
Yes, he's small in stature,

but I don't know how
he keep manipulating the system.

This man is dangerous.

You have to understand something.
You told the police that he doesn't...

We never had a physical altercation.
That's why I don't know

where he's getting these things from.
It's like once he found out

we were gonna divorce,
he didn't want to leave the house.

So that's why he kept having
to try to put a case on me.

-[Judy] All may be true.
-[Lucinda] Yes.

There is no indication here,
as a matter of fact, quite the contrary,

that he ever put his hands on you.

He never put his hands on me.
And I never placed a hand on him.

[Judy]
Your sister... Your sister did.

Now, you can sit down.

Can I just tell you how we even got here.

-[Judy] No.
-[Lucretia] All I want to say...

I'm just telling you,
I don't care how you got here.

This happened two and a half,
three years ago.

And the reason that you're here
is because of an incident

that had, in its beginnings, you going
to a place where you had no right to be.

Can I please show you the medical reports

'cause there's no way
I ran down the street.

Just a second. I'm gonna read
what you told the police.

After a brief verbal altercation,
Francis punched her in the face.

They both began fighting
in the middle of the street.

Francis then began to walk down
Kensingson Street towards Chapel Street.

Lucretia said she ran after Francis

and began fighting with him
until the police arrived.

Okay. Your case is dismissed.

Now, you have any medical records
of your injuries?

-[Dwight] Yes.
-I'd like to see them.

[Dwight]
I have a scar, too.

Just a second. I'd like to see them.

[Lucretia] I'm telling you,
I did not run after him.

How can I run? How can I run after him
if my knee has a torn meniscus?

Do you want me to play the tape of you

walking through the door
into the courtroom? Yes, you did.

I can walk. Yeah, but I'm still in pain
for the rest of my life.

I have to get surgery, Your Honor.

Not only is your case gonna be dismissed,

but because I see
you can't control yourself,

even in a courtroom,
you can't control yourself,

I'm hearing his case now.
He's got a cross-complaint.

And as far as I'm concerned,
you were the aggressor.

-You went there...
-I did.

...to a potentially aggressive situation,

by yourself. By yourself.

She had something in her hand too,
I never see what it was

but I know that she throw it away.

[Judy]
Shh. Do you think that I need your help.

[Dwight]
Okay.

Forget it. I'm telling you
this man is dangerous.

You'll see, he'll be arrested again.

See what I mean?
You can't control yourself.

You want me to believe that you
got out of the car and calmly said,

"Why are you calling the police
on my sister?"

Somebody who can't control themselves
in a courtroom.

Judgment for the Defendant
on the counterclaim

in the amount of $5,000.
Your claim is dismissed.

-Thank you.
-[bailiff] This court is adjourned.

I'm just sad about the whole situation

because I feel like
I should've won this case.

Everything is in facts. And
that's how it happened. It was the truth.

I just figure she was going to jail.
So I wanted to get my nephew and leave.

I want to be a good parent.

It goes on. He's manipulating the system
and it shows.

That whole case just seemed like a mess
all the way around.

I think the Plaintiff went there
maybe a little hotter

than she was ready to admit.
I think the police report

seemed enlightening
after you took a look at that

and read her own account
of what she told the officer.

And, you know, he didn't seem like
Prince Charming either, though.

So, I'm annoyed that you gave him
the judgment.

I agree with it
because it was so unclear...

I gave him the judgment, actually...

'Cause she couldn't control herself.

Because you're in a courtroom setting...

and you try to take somebody's demeanor
in a courtroom setting,

which is intimidating. I mean,
I'm intimidating.

I know that I'm intimidating.
Couldn't control herself.

You know, you have to couple the law
with common sense.

He's no doll, for sure, but
he extricated himself from the house.

-Because according to her...
-He ran down the street.

No, he was outside when she got there.
The police report was clear.

He again tried to extricate himself
by walking away.

And when the police arrived,
they were fighting on the street.

-[Sarah] Again.
-Again.

Because she had caught up with him.
She said she went there to get her nephew.

You can call the police and say,
I think there's gonna be a problem,

would you take me over there,
there's a domestic case.

But she went over there hot.
And the reason he was awarded money

is because she couldn't control herself,
even here.

There was no question in my mind
she was the aggressor.

No, I agree.

[announcer]
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[theme music playing]