BALLOONS POPPING,
CHILDREN SQUEALING
BALLOONS POPPING,
CHILDREN SQUEALING
In 1964,
Granada Television brought together
In 1964,
Granada Television brought together
a group of seven-year-olds.
We have followed their lives
every seven years.
We have followed their lives
every seven years.
They talked about their dreams,
their ambitions...
They talked about their dreams,
their ambitions...
..and their fears for the future.
..and their fears for the future.
Give me a child
until he is seven,
and I will give you the man.
I read the Financial Times.
I read the Financial Times.
Sometimes, we can't play nicely
with the boys,
Sometimes, we can't play nicely
with the boys,
and sometimes, we go out and argue
with the boys.
and sometimes, we go out and argue
with the boys.
Do you want to be rich?
Well, yes,
because I don't want to be tied down
Well, yes,
because I don't want to be tied down
to the dullness
of an everyday job.
to the dullness
of an everyday job.
I think if you're healthy
and have good friends,
I think if you're healthy
and have good friends,
you can get on perfectly well.
What do you want for yourself, then?
Just be content with what I'm doing,
to know where I'm going,
Just be content with what I'm doing,
to know where I'm going,
Just be content with what I'm doing,
to know where I'm going,
and to remember fondly
what I've done.
I'd like to find out
all about the moon and all that.
I'd like to find out
all about the moon and all that.
I'd like to find out
all about the moon and all that.
Do you want to take up farming?
No.
Do you want to take up farming?
No.
But as a last resort.
Was gonna be a film star
but now I'm gonna be
an electrical engineer.
but now I'm gonna be
an electrical engineer.
Aren't you worth more than this?
Aren't you worth more than this?
I'm going to work in Woolworths.
I'm going to work in Woolworths.
I would help the poor.
Yeah, cos the poor,
if you don't help them, they'll
sort of die soon, wouldn't they?
if you don't help them, they'll
sort of die soon, wouldn't they?
Well, some people are just born into
rich families, and they're lucky.
Well, some people are just born into
rich families, and they're lucky.
An education is very important.
Good education, that's something
that no-one can take away.
Good education, that's something
that no-one can take away.
Because we've been
to private schools,
it's not
that we're better qualified.
it's not
that we're better qualified.
We've been taught to expect more.
We've been taught to expect more.
The posh 'uns,
"Oh, yes, oh, yes, oh, yes."
The posh 'uns,
"Oh, yes, oh, yes, oh, yes."
They're nuts.
Obviously, if you come
from with a silver spoon,
Obviously, if you come
from with a silver spoon,
you're gonna get more attractive
jobs and easier life.
you're gonna get more attractive
jobs and easier life.
But I think you've also seen that
it doesn't always work that way.
But I think you've also seen that
it doesn't always work that way.
But I think you've also seen that
it doesn't always work that way.
At seven and 14,
everybody was in love with you.
At seven and 14,
everybody was in love with you.
And now nobody speaks to me.
When I leave school,
I may want to go to a university,
When I leave school,
I may want to go to a university,
but I don't know which one yet.
What does university mean?
What does university mean?
Why is it
that you three haven't changed?
Why is it
that you three haven't changed?
We've all had a stable background
with stable relationships.
We've all had a stable background
with stable relationships.
'You can be born shy.
You can be born as an extrovert.
'You can be born shy.
You can be born as an extrovert.
'You can be born shy.
You can be born as an extrovert.
'You can be someone
who likes to make people laugh.
'You can be someone
who likes to make people laugh.
'You can be someone
who's much quieter and deeper.'
'You can be someone
who's much quieter and deeper.'
And I think that's in you,
but then life happens.
And I think that's in you,
but then life happens.
And I think that's in you,
but then life happens.
I have had regretful behaviour
at various times.
I have had regretful behaviour
at various times.
We all make mistakes in everything,
from parenting to decisions in life,
We all make mistakes in everything,
from parenting to decisions in life,
We all make mistakes in everything,
from parenting to decisions in life,
and that's how you become
the person you are.
The years are flying through my mind
at the moment.
The years are flying through my mind
at the moment.
The future is not maybe as bright
as it would have been
The future is not maybe as bright
as it would have been
for a kid coming out a university
like me in the late '70s.
for a kid coming out a university
like me in the late '70s.
for a kid coming out a university
like me in the late '70s.
I can't really recognise myself.
He looks a little bit lost
and a little bit sad,
He looks a little bit lost
and a little bit sad,
and I'm quite sort of surprised
to be sort of contented.
and I'm quite sort of surprised
to be sort of contented.
The moment of pure,
unadulterated joy in my life
The moment of pure,
unadulterated joy in my life
was when my son was handed to me
when he was born.
was when my son was handed to me
when he was born.
I have never felt so optimistic,
I have never felt so optimistic,
so just purely unworried
about anything.
so just purely unworried
about anything.
so just purely unworried
about anything.
Real-life TV, with the added bonus
that you can see people grow old,
Real-life TV, with the added bonus
that you can see people grow old,
Real-life TV, with the added bonus
that you can see people grow old,
lose their hair, get fat.
Fascinating.
lose their hair, get fat.
Fascinating.
Cheers!
Every time this programme starts,
it says,
Every time this programme starts,
it says,
"Give me a child till they're seven,
and I will give you the man."
"Give me a child till they're seven,
and I will give you the man."
Is that true or false?
CHILDREN SQUEALING
CHILDREN SQUEALING
They're teddy bears.
They're not real.
CHILDREN SQUEALING
CHILDREN SQUEALING
Look at those claws.
Look at those claws.
This is
no ordinary outing at the zoo.
This is
no ordinary outing at the zoo.
It's a very special occasion.
We've brought these 20 children
together for the very first time.
We've brought these 20 children
together for the very first time.
CHILDREN SQUEALING
CHILDREN SQUEALING
They're like any other children,
except that they come from
startlingly different backgrounds.
Except that they come from
startlingly different backgrounds.
You musn't give it.
"No feeding," it says.
You musn't give it.
"No feeding," it says.
We brought these children together
We brought these children together
because we wanted a glimpse
of England in the year 2000.
Because we wanted a glimpse
of England in the year 2000.
Because we wanted a glimpse
of England in the year 2000.
LAUGHTER
LAUGHTER
Let's get to know these children.
Let's get to know these children.
What do you think
about rich people?
What do you think
about rich people?
Er...
Not much.
Rich children always make fun
of poor children, I think.
Yes.
Yes. They say, "Oh, look at that
lovely little sissy over there."
Yes. They say, "Oh, look at that
lovely little sissy over there."
Or something horrible.
Yes.
They're nuts.
Just have to touch 'em.
They'd like to come out
for a holiday in the country
They'd like to come out
for a holiday in the country
They'd like to come out
for a holiday in the country
when we like... when I'd like
to have a holiday in the town.
when we like... when I'd like
to have a holiday in the town.
What would you do
if you had lots of money?
Me?
About £2.
Me?
About £2.
I would buy myself
a new nice house now.
I would buy myself
a new nice house now.
I would buy myself
a new nice house now.
One that's all nice and comfy.
One that's all nice and comfy.
We should give all... some... most
of our money to the poor people.
We should give all... some... most
of our money to the poor people.
We should give all... some... most
of our money to the poor people.
When I grow up,
I want to be an astronaut,
When I grow up,
I want to be an astronaut,
but if I can't be an astronaut,
I think I'll be a coach driver.
but if I can't be an astronaut,
I think I'll be a coach driver.
but if I can't be an astronaut,
I think I'll be a coach driver.
BELL RINGS,
HE GRUNTS
I was born a little Artful Dodger
on the street.
I was born a little Artful Dodger
on the street.
Arse hanging out my trousers.
Arse hanging out my trousers.
I was always here, there
and everywhere.
I was always here, there
and everywhere.
Adventure. Cheeky.
Adventure. Cheeky.
Is it important to fight? Yes.
Is it important to fight? Yes.
And I've never changed.
A bird said to me the other day,
"Ain't you small?"
A bird said to me the other day,
"Ain't you small?"
So I said, "But you're ugly.
At least I can grow."
So I said, "But you're ugly.
At least I can grow."
I wanna be a jockey when I grow up.
Yeah, I want to be a jockey
when I grow up.
Yeah, I want to be a jockey
when I grow up.
Tony left his East End
secondary modern school at 15.
Tony left his East End
secondary modern school at 15.
I walked into a stable, and there...
it was like a mammoth racehorse.
it was like a mammoth racehorse.
I got on it.
And now I'm up in the air.
And now I'm up in the air.
And I felt like I was John Wayne
in the Wild West...
And I felt like I was John Wayne
in the Wild West...
..and the die was cast.
Within a month,
he called me in the office.
He said, "You get on
with that horse, don't you?"
He said, "You get on
with that horse, don't you?"
I said, "Yes, sir."
He said, "I'm just letting you know
"you're riding him
at Kempton in a race.
"you're riding him
at Kempton in a race.
"Tell your mum and dad.
Make sure they're there."
"Tell your mum and dad.
Make sure they're there."
I'm a wet-behind-the-ear kid,
I'm a wet-behind-the-ear kid,
and there I am,
walking into the parade ring,
and there I am,
walking into the parade ring,
seeing my mum and dad crying.
HE CLICKS TONGUE
I thought to myself,
here I was yesterday,
sort of nobody,
here I was yesterday,
sort of nobody,
and here I am today, I'm king.
and here I am today, I'm king.
Like, I felt king for one day
or for ten minutes.
Like, I felt king for one day
or for ten minutes.
But my guv'nor said,
"I've got faith in you, Tony, but,"
he says,
"I've got faith in you, Tony, but,"
he says,
"you're gonna find it hard."
I said, "Why is that?"
He said, "Your weight."
I said, "Why is that?"
He said, "Your weight."
I said, "Weight?
I'm 8 stone 2, Guv'nor."
I said, "Weight?
I'm 8 stone 2, Guv'nor."
He said, "I know,
but you're getting lumpy now.
He said, "I know,
but you're getting lumpy now.
"You're getting bigger."
And I thought about my weight.
And I thought about my weight.
I thought about the ambition,
the longevity,
I thought about the ambition,
the longevity,
and I thought, "That's me blown."
and I thought, "That's me blown."
And I went out the game, and it...
And I went out the game, and it...
..broke...
It broke my heart.
It was the greatest mistake
I've ever made in my life
It was the greatest mistake
I've ever made in my life
at that particular time, saying,
"Right, let's go home,"
at that particular time, saying,
"Right, let's go home,"
and it wasn't the right decision.
What will you do
if you don't make it as a jockey?
What will you do
if you don't make it as a jockey?
I don't know.
If I knew I couldn't be one,
I'd get out of the game.
If I knew I couldn't be one,
I'd get out of the game.
Wouldn't bother.
What do you think you would do then?
Wouldn't bother.
What do you think you would do then?
Wouldn't bother.
What do you think you would do then?
Learn on taxis. Taxi driver.
Learn on taxis. Taxi driver.
It's surprising who you pick up,
you see.
It's surprising who you pick up,
you see.
I once met Kojak. I picked him up.
I once met Kojak. I picked him up.
But, son, it's hard work out there.
You're not reaching me yet.
But, son, it's hard work out there.
You're not reaching me yet.
At 28,
Tony was taking acting lessons.
At 28,
Tony was taking acting lessons.
Be bigger. Dominate me. All right?
Son...
Yeah.
Son, it's a big world out there,
and obviously, I'm not...
Son, it's a big world out there,
and obviously, I'm not...
I can't get into it, Brian.
All right, don't worry.
I can't get into it, Brian.
All right, don't worry.
Pardon the expression,
but can you do my inside leg?
Pardon the expression,
but can you do my inside leg?
He now works as an extra.
Now I know how Bruce Willis feels.
'I'll have a go at anything,
especially acting.
'I've always said it -
'there's never, ever a thing
in my life
'I've never set out to do
that I've never achieved.
'I've never set out to do
that I've never achieved.
'I wanted to be a jockey.
'Thank God, I rode on a race
with Lester Piggott, and I did it.
'Thank God, I rode on a race
with Lester Piggott, and I did it.
'I wanted to be in the film game -
I got in it,
'I wanted to be in the film game -
I got in it,
'working with Steven Spielberg
for two weeks on one of his films.'
'working with Steven Spielberg
for two weeks on one of his films.'
'working with Steven Spielberg
for two weeks on one of his films.'
I made it happen on my terms,
and no-one can say, "I helped him."
I made it happen on my terms,
and no-one can say, "I helped him."
I made it happen on my terms,
and no-one can say, "I helped him."
And I'm more stronger
in that respect.
But you didn't pull it off.
You didn't pull a jockey off.
But you didn't pull it off.
You didn't pull a jockey off.
You haven't made it as an actor.
You didn't pull off the pub.
You haven't made it as an actor.
You didn't pull off the pub.
You haven't made it as an actor.
You didn't pull off the pub.
Well, it's better to be a has-been
than a never-was, wasn't it?
Well, it's better to be a has-been
than a never-was, wasn't it?
'My ambitions have gone out the
window now cos I'm running a family.
'My ambitions have gone out the
window now cos I'm running a family.
'My ambitions have gone out the
window now cos I'm running a family.
'I'm playing a role now.
That is my role in life, I feel.'
'I'm playing a role now.
That is my role in life, I feel.'
Have you got a girlfriend?
No.
Have you got a girlfriend?
No.
Would you like to have a girlfriend?
No.
Would you like to have a girlfriend?
No.
You understand the four Fs?
Find 'em, feed 'em...
and forget 'em.
Find 'em, feed 'em...
and forget 'em.
The other F, I'll let you use
your own discrimin...
The other F, I'll let you use
your own discrimin...
I mean, this one,
I mean, this one,
I tried to do the three Fs,
but I couldn't forget her.
I tried to do the three Fs,
but I couldn't forget her.
I tried to do the three Fs,
but I couldn't forget her.
He was in the pub earlier on,
and afterwards,
we went to a discotheque,
and afterwards,
we went to a discotheque,
and Tony was down there,
and I just...
and Tony was down there,
and I just...
from there, I just... that was it.
from there, I just... that was it.
HE CHUCKLES
HE CHUCKLES
Couldn't get rid of him.
THEY LAUGH
Couldn't get rid of him.
THEY LAUGH
We have our ups and downs,
no more than anyone else.
We have our ups and downs,
no more than anyone else.
I think you've got to work
at a marriage.
I think you've got to work
at a marriage.
I think all marriages
go through stages.
I think all marriages
go through stages.
You can't stand each other.
You go through, you know,
You can't stand each other.
You go through, you know,
I think, "Oh, God, I hate him."
"I wish he'd get out."
Oof.
I'm not proud at all to say this,
I'm not proud at all to say this,
but situations arise that...
but situations arise that...
I have... have had
regretful behaviour
I have... have had
regretful behaviour
at various times, but...
at various times, but...
through...
You got caught.
Yeah, I...
And that was it.
I don't really know how I've got
over things with him, to be honest.
I don't really know how I've got
over things with him, to be honest.
I don't really know how I've got
over things with him, to be honest.
I don't really know how I've got
over things with him, to be honest.
Sometimes, I don't feel that I have,
to be perfectly honest with you.
Sometimes, I don't feel that I have,
to be perfectly honest with you.
Sometimes, I don't feel that I have,
to be perfectly honest with you.
Erm...
But I'm still here.
But I'm still here.
What can I say?
We are, aren't we?
What can I say?
We are, aren't we?
Yeah.
I've always loved you,
from the moment I met you,
I've always loved you,
from the moment I met you,
despite any things
I've ever... done.
despite any things
I've ever... done.
despite any things
I've ever... done.
But in saying that, I'm here,
you're here, I'm here,
But in saying that, I'm here,
you're here, I'm here,
and we're still together
after, what, 46 years?
and we're still together
after, what, 46 years?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Lifetime.
Nothing wrong with that.
SHE LAUGHS
BELL RINGS
'I've fulfilled everything
I've wanted to do,
'I've fulfilled everything
I've wanted to do,
'silly as it may seem.
'I'm at the last nine holes
of my life now.
'I'm at the last nine holes
of my life now.
'I'm 70 years old and very happy
in my semi-retirement.'
'I'm 70 years old and very happy
in my semi-retirement.'
'I'm 70 years old and very happy
in my semi-retirement.'
SINGING IN LATIN
SINGING IN LATIN
Singing Waltzing Matilda in Latin
at an exclusive pre-preparatory
school in London,
at an exclusive pre-preparatory
school in London,
Charles...
..Andrew and John.
..Andrew and John.
When I leave the school,
I'm going to Connaught Court.
When I leave the school,
I'm going to Connaught Court.
When I leave the school,
I'm going to Connaught Court.
And then I will be going
to Westminster boarding school
And then I will be going
to Westminster boarding school
if I pass the exam.
And then we think I'm going
to Cambridge and Trinity Hall.
And then we think I'm going
to Cambridge and Trinity Hall.
And then we think I'm going
to Cambridge and Trinity Hall.
John went to Westminster School.
Are you ambitious?
Yes.
What for?
Yes.
What for?
Well...
Well, fame.
And power.
What sort of power?
Political power.
What sort of power?
Political power.
Are you ruthless?
Not really.
Are you ruthless?
Not really.
Do you think you can have political
power without being ruthless?
Do you think you can have political
power without being ruthless?
Yes.
Well, what qualities do you need
to have political power, then,
Well, what qualities do you need
to have political power, then,
if it's not ruthlessness?
Great strength of mind.
John is in his final year at
Christ Church, Oxford, reading law.
John is in his final year at
Christ Church, Oxford, reading law.
I do believe parents have a right
to educate their children
as they think fit.
to educate their children
as they think fit.
I think someone
who works on the assembly line
I think someone
who works on the assembly line
in some of these car factories
and earning a huge wage
in some of these car factories
and earning a huge wage
could well afford to send
their children to private school
could well afford to send
their children to private school
if they wanted to.
I now have a career.
I'm a barrister.
I now have a career.
I'm a barrister.
Other than that,
life chugs along in varying degrees.
Other than that,
life chugs along in varying degrees.
Well, in a sense, not very much
has changed in my career
Well, in a sense, not very much
has changed in my career
over the last 14 years.
I'm still a barrister,
and I still wear a curly white wig.
I'm still a barrister,
and I still wear a curly white wig.
The only visible difference,
I suppose,
The only visible difference,
I suppose,
is I wear a silk gown
because I'm now a QC.
is I wear a silk gown
because I'm now a QC.
Week after next is ideal.
Yeah, the week after next.
Week after next is ideal.
Yeah, the week after next.
Except for Monday. I know...
'I'm a chancery
commercial barrister.
'I'm a chancery
commercial barrister.
'I'm involved in various big cases
'I'm involved in various big cases
'which all are working
towards a trial in court
'which all are working
towards a trial in court
'at the end of the day.'
But with these big cases, there's
a lot of work that needs to be done
But with these big cases, there's
a lot of work that needs to be done
But with these big cases, there's
a lot of work that needs to be done
before the case ever comes to court.
before the case ever comes to court.
In the last seven years,
In the last seven years,
I suppose the changes are
a bit less hair, on the one hand,
I suppose the changes are
a bit less hair, on the one hand,
and a bit stiffer,
getting on and off of horses
in particular.
getting on and off of horses
in particular.
I do believe in a sort of ordered
and structured society,
I do believe in a sort of ordered
and structured society,
and I think... you know...
and I think... you know...
we're not exactly alive
for very long.
we're not exactly alive
for very long.
We've each got our own job to do
We've each got our own job to do
and our own little position
to be in.
and our own little position
to be in.
'Some people have a better time
than others,
'Some people have a better time
than others,
'but, you know, it doesn't mean
because you sweep the streets,
'but, you know, it doesn't mean
because you sweep the streets,
'you're any less valuable
'you're any less valuable
'than someone who's running
a huge corporation.'
'than someone who's running
a huge corporation.'
DOGS BARKING
DOGS BARKING
'Not everyone can be at the top.'
The hounds are over there, I think.
The hounds are over there, I think.
'I hadn't been very happy
with the way I'd been portrayed.'
'I hadn't been very happy
with the way I'd been portrayed.'
'I hadn't been very happy
with the way I'd been portrayed.'
I felt... that I had been set up...
I felt... that I had been set up...
I felt... that I had been set up...
..as the... bad guy or bogeyman
..as the... bad guy or bogeyman
..as the... bad guy or bogeyman
to represent
an outmoded... class system
to represent
an outmoded... class system
to represent
an outmoded... class system
that had no validity
in the modern world.
that had no validity
in the modern world.
From this Liverpool suburb...
From this Liverpool suburb...
..we chose Neil.
..we chose Neil.
When I go home, I come... I come in,
and Mummy gives me a cup of tea,
When I go home, I come... I come in,
and Mummy gives me a cup of tea,
When I go home, I come... I come in,
and Mummy gives me a cup of tea,
When I go home, I come... I come in,
and Mummy gives me a cup of tea,
and then I go out and play.
Well, we pretend we've got swords,
Well, we pretend we've got swords,
and we make
the noise of the swords fighting.
and we make
the noise of the swords fighting.
And when somebody stabs us,
we go, "Ahh!"
And when somebody stabs us,
we go, "Ahh!"
'Then I moved
up to a comprehensive school.'
Being in set one, it's very, very
hard to keep up with the leaders.
Being in set one, it's very, very
hard to keep up with the leaders.
I never have a time to relax at all.
I never have a time to relax at all.
Neil grew up
in a Liverpool suburb
Neil grew up
in a Liverpool suburb
and had dreams of going to Oxford
but didn't get in.
and had dreams of going to Oxford
but didn't get in.
and had dreams of going to Oxford
but didn't get in.
Instead,
he went to Aberdeen University
Instead,
he went to Aberdeen University
but dropped out
after the first term.
but dropped out
after the first term.
A 21, Neil was working on a building
site and living in a squat.
A 21, Neil was working on a building
site and living in a squat.
A 21, Neil was working on a building
site and living in a squat.
'You've kicked
against the stability.'
'You've kicked
against the stability.'
I don't think I ever had any
stability... to be quite honest.
I don't think I ever had any
stability... to be quite honest.
I don't think I ever had any
stability... to be quite honest.
I can't think of any time
in my life when I ever did.
I can't think of any time
in my life when I ever did.
I don't think I've been kicking
against anything.
I don't think I've been kicking
against anything.
I think I've been kicking in midair
the whole of my life.
I think I've been kicking in midair
the whole of my life.
For the last seven years,
Neil has been moving around Britain.
For the last seven years,
Neil has been moving around Britain.
He was homeless.
'Do you begrudge people
who have wealth?'
'Do you begrudge people
who have wealth?'
Not really. I wish they used it
more for the good of humankind.
Not really. I wish they used it
more for the good of humankind.
Not really. I wish they used it
more for the good of humankind.
I think it's important
that the people who are in authority
I think it's important
that the people who are in authority
should have
as much knowledge and experience
should have
as much knowledge and experience
of as many things as possible.
Otherwise, they aren't...
they aren't fit to make judgements
Otherwise, they aren't...
they aren't fit to make judgements
that affect other people.
that affect other people.
And I think it's tragic
that so many people in authority
And I think it's tragic
that so many people in authority
have had so little experience
of... of... of suffering,
have had so little experience
of... of... of suffering,
have had so little experience
of... of... of suffering,
perhaps of homelessness,
of being short of money,
perhaps of homelessness,
of being short of money,
perhaps of homelessness,
of being short of money,
of having
their own independence threatened.
of having
their own independence threatened.
Some people just seem to make
a very short cut to the top.
Some people just seem to make
a very short cut to the top.
Now, I've no doubt that this is
because they have the abilities
Now, I've no doubt that this is
because they have the abilities
to get them there.
This is... This speaks for itself,
but they get there
without going through the swamps.
but they get there
without going through the swamps.
but they get there
without going through the swamps.
They get there on the easy road,
and once they get there,
They get there on the easy road,
and once they get there,
they're in no situation
to understand the feelings of people
they're in no situation
to understand the feelings of people
who've never got out of the swamp.
I'm a lot happier now
than I was seven years ago.
I'm a lot happier now
than I was seven years ago.
Do you accept things more?
Is that what you're saying?
Do you accept things more?
Is that what you're saying?
Yes, I think so.
But why should you accept this?
But why should you accept this?
You're better than all this,
aren't you?
You're better than all this,
aren't you?
No, I'm not better
than anything or anybody.
No, I'm not better
than anything or anybody.
No, I'm not better
than anything or anybody.
I'm just somebody with...
with my own particular difficulties,
I'm just somebody with...
with my own particular difficulties,
I'm just somebody with...
with my own particular difficulties,
my own particular obstacles
to surmount.
my own particular obstacles
to surmount.
And everybody else
is doing exactly the same thing.
And everybody else
is doing exactly the same thing.
At 35, he's living in a council flat
in the Shetland Islands.
At 35, he's living in a council flat
in the Shetland Islands.
Nice thing about here
is that you can cut yourself off
Nice thing about here
is that you can cut yourself off
when you want because
there are people living around,
when you want because
there are people living around,
but they're pretty quiet people.
How do you manage
for money these days?
Social security.
Still. I wish it wasn't,
but I'm afraid it is.
Still. I wish it wasn't,
but I'm afraid it is.
I've no desire
to be putting the taxes up
and drawing money off people
who've earn it themselves.
and drawing money off people
who've earn it themselves.
and drawing money off people
who've earn it themselves.
So, do you think you have failed?
Can't really judge.
Do you feel you've failed yourself?
Well, my life isn't over.
Can you think what you'd like
to be doing in the year 2000?
Can you think what you'd like
to be doing in the year 2000?
Can you think what you'd like
to be doing in the year 2000?
I can think of all kinds of things
that I'd like to be doing.
I can think of all kinds of things
that I'd like to be doing.
The real question is what...
what am I...
The real question is what...
what am I...
what am I likely to be doing?
Erm...
What are you likely to be doing?
And that's a horrible question.
What are you likely to be doing?
And that's a horrible question.
I tend to think
the most likely answer
I tend to think
the most likely answer
is that I'll be wandering homeless
around the streets of London.
is that I'll be wandering homeless
around the streets of London.
But with a bit of luck,
that won't happen.
But with a bit of luck,
that won't happen.
Some of
the considerable disadvantages
Some of
the considerable disadvantages
that residents of the Trowbridge
Estate area have in comparison -
that residents of the Trowbridge
Estate area have in comparison -
they are geographically isolated,
they're separated
from most of Hackney by...
they're separated
from most of Hackney by...
At 42, he's a Liberal Democrat
member of Hackney Council.
At 42, he's a Liberal Democrat
member of Hackney Council.
At 42, he's a Liberal Democrat
member of Hackney Council.
He was elected two years ago.
He was elected two years ago.
'While I was in Shetland,
'I felt very strongly that
I should become involved in politics
'I felt very strongly that
I should become involved in politics
'simply because I felt
I was not achieving anything
'simply because I felt
I was not achieving anything
'in the ways I really wanted to.
'And I could see
decisions being made politically
'And I could see
decisions being made politically
'by people I felt
were not competent to make them
'by people I felt
were not competent to make them
'and who I felt
were not representing
'the majority of the public,
and I felt angry.'
'the majority of the public,
and I felt angry.'
And I thought, in my own small way,
And I thought, in my own small way,
I've got to get in there,
and I think more people should.
I've got to get in there,
and I think more people should.
I think it's only apathy which leads
to bad government at any level.
I think it's only apathy which leads
to bad government at any level.
I think it's only apathy which leads
to bad government at any level.
At 49, Neil has left London,
At 49, Neil has left London,
moved to Cumbria
in the North West of England.
Moved to Cumbria
in the North West of England.
CHOIR SINGS
CHOIR SINGS
♪ Are the Holy One
♪ Are the Holy One
♪ Are the Holy One
♪ You alone. ♪
♪ You alone. ♪
'I'm the lay minister.
'I'm licensed to carry out
quite a number of functions.'
'I'm licensed to carry out
quite a number of functions.'
It includes services, preaching,
taking part in the readings,
It includes services, preaching,
taking part in the readings,
It includes services, preaching,
taking part in the readings,
helping to distribute the communion,
and so on.
helping to distribute the communion,
and so on.
In fact, I can do more or less
everything a priest can do.
In fact, I can do more or less
everything a priest can do.
If you haven't already been told,
the proposed pet show
is unfortunately cancelled.
the proposed pet show
is unfortunately cancelled.
the proposed pet show
is unfortunately cancelled.
'I wake up every day, and
I don't know what's gonna happen.'
'I wake up every day, and
I don't know what's gonna happen.'
I don't know where I will be
in a month's time,
I don't know where I will be
in a month's time,
six months' time, a year's time.
six months' time, a year's time.
My Christian faith helps me.
Richard, nice to see you.
Pleased, Sarah.
Richard, nice to see you.
Pleased, Sarah.
I do enjoy times
of interaction with others,
I do enjoy times
of interaction with others,
but the gut experience of my life
but the gut experience of my life
is a very lonely struggle
is a very lonely struggle
to try to get towards something I...
to try to get towards something I...
I much of the time imagine
I'm never going to get to.
I much of the time imagine
I'm never going to get to.
I much of the time imagine
I'm never going to get to.
So it's...
It is like somebody climbing a rock
face only to keep falling back,
It is like somebody climbing a rock
face only to keep falling back,
It is like somebody climbing a rock
face only to keep falling back,
and every so often,
you have to ask yourself, "Why?"
and every so often,
you have to ask yourself, "Why?"
But you can't just stay
where you are.
But you can't just stay
where you are.
Human beings are existential beings.
Human beings are existential beings.
We have to strive
towards what we want to achieve.
We have to strive
towards what we want to achieve.
One has to retire at some point.
There's no perfect time.
One has to retire at some point.
There's no perfect time.
The issue is just where does
the money come from now I'm retired?
The issue is just where does
the money come from now I'm retired?
The issue is just where does
the money come from now I'm retired?
But we'll deal with that
as the issues come along.
But we'll deal with that
as the issues come along.
I'm now a resident of France,
not a French citizen,
I'm now a resident of France,
not a French citizen,
but I am a resident of France.
but I am a resident of France.
I'm living in the house I came to
for so many years on holiday.
I'm living in the house I came to
for so many years on holiday.
I'm living in the house I came to
for so many years on holiday.
It's a bit damp in places...
It's a bit damp in places...
but serves me fine.
but serves me fine.
And the house is a lot bigger
than the very small flat
I was living in in Cumbria.
than the very small flat
I was living in in Cumbria.
It's nice to move around,
but in fact,
It's nice to move around,
but in fact,
I don't use all the rooms anyway,
I don't use all the rooms anyway,
especially not in the winter...
cos there's no heating in the house.
especially not in the winter...
cos there's no heating in the house.
especially not in the winter...
cos there's no heating in the house.
I know this looks a bit
like some of those houses
I know this looks a bit
like some of those houses
where people hoard things and...
where people hoard things and...
..and it ends up all falling over,
..and it ends up all falling over,
but actually,
it does have a purpose.
but actually,
it does have a purpose.
And hopefully, by about November,
it will be a lot less.
And hopefully, by about November,
it will be a lot less.
When I get married,
I don't want to have any children
When I get married,
I don't want to have any children
because they are always doing
naughty things
because they are always doing
naughty things
because they are always doing
naughty things
and making the whole house untidy.
and making the whole house untidy.
And what about you, Jackie?
My mum, cos she got five girls,
she had seven years' bad luck.
My mum, cos she got five girls,
she had seven years' bad luck.
My mum, cos she got five girls,
she had seven years' bad luck.
That's why she's got five girls.
That's why she's got five girls.
'Jackie, Lynn and Susan,
'Jackie, Lynn and Susan,
'they went to primary school
together in the East End of London.
'they went to primary school
together in the East End of London.
'Lynn chose to go
on to a grammar school
'Lynn chose to go
on to a grammar school
'and Jackie and Susan
to a comprehensive.'
'and Jackie and Susan
to a comprehensive.'
There is a danger that
you would get married at early 20s
There is a danger that
you would get married at early 20s
and have children quickly
and then be stuck at home.
And have children quickly
and then be stuck at home.
Have you any thoughts on that?
Have you any thoughts on that?
I don't really think about it much.
No.
I don't really think about it much.
No.
I don't think I'd...
..get married too early.
I'd like to have a full life first
and meet people.
I'd like to have a full life first
and meet people.
I'd like to enjoy myself before I...
Yeah.
I'd like to enjoy myself before I...
Yeah.
Before you commit yourself
to a family.
Before you commit yourself
to a family.
We had a teacher at school
that his favourite ploy was,
We had a teacher at school
that his favourite ploy was,
We had a teacher at school
that his favourite ploy was,
"All you girls want to do
is walk out..."
"All you girls want to do
is walk out..."
Is get married.
"get married, have babies,
"and push a pram down the street
"with a f*g hanging
out the side of your mouth."
"with a f*g hanging
out the side of your mouth."
God, if there's ever a sentence
I'd resent,
God, if there's ever a sentence
I'd resent,
it'd be that one.
Yeah.
Jackie was married last year and
now lives on a new estate in Essex.
Jackie was married last year and
now lives on a new estate in Essex.
Jackie was married last year and
now lives on a new estate in Essex.
It's a nice estate. Yeah.
Yeah, it's not bad at all.
It's a nice estate. Yeah.
Yeah, it's not bad at all.
What are they like, the neighbours?
Do you see a lot of them or what?
What are they like, the neighbours?
Do you see a lot of them or what?
Well, you know, sort of just say
hello to them more than anything.
Well, you know, sort of just say
hello to them more than anything.
I mean, we borrow things
off of them, which is just as well!
I mean, we borrow things
off of them, which is just as well!
Yeah. Look through there.
That's the nursery,
if you don't mind.
The baby's room.
Yeah. Baby's room.
The baby's room.
Yeah. Baby's room.
Got any plans?
Oh, do me a favour.
Got any plans?
Oh, do me a favour.
Already? So soon?
At 21,
Jackie had moved into a new house.
At 21,
Jackie had moved into a new house.
She has decided not to have
any children.
She has decided not to have
any children.
'Basically, I would say
because I'm far too selfish.'
'Basically, I would say
because I'm far too selfish.'
I enjoy doing what I want,
when I want and how I want,
I enjoy doing what I want,
when I want and how I want,
I enjoy doing what I want,
when I want and how I want,
and certainly at the moment, I...
I can't see any way around that.
and certainly at the moment, I...
I can't see any way around that.
and certainly at the moment, I...
I can't see any way around that.
and certainly at the moment, I...
I can't see any way around that.
Jackie works for
an insurance company in the city.
Jackie works for
an insurance company in the city.
'I certainly don't wanna stay
'in the position I am at the moment
forever and ever.
'in the position I am at the moment
forever and ever.
'But how ambitious,
I'm not really sure.
'Tends to change as you get older
'Tends to change as you get older
'so... just gotta wait and see,
really.'
'so... just gotta wait and see,
really.'
Everything's not that cut and dried.
Everything's not that cut and dried.
It's not either career
or family or...
It's not either career
or family or...
But it's what's in the middle.
I mean, am I just gonna carry on
as I am now for...
I mean, am I just gonna carry on
as I am now for...
SHE LAUGHS
..and end up on the shelf?
SHE LAUGHS
..and end up on the shelf?
Or am I just going to get married?
Could be any day, but...
Or am I just going to get married?
Could be any day, but...
I suppose Lynn is a career girl
in a way, isn't she?
Yeah, she's more wrapped up
in her job than I think we are.
Yeah, she's more wrapped up
in her job than I think we are.
Well, I'm a school mobile librarian
Well, I'm a school mobile librarian
and assistant
to the young people's office,
and assistant
to the young people's office,
which is where we are now.
And I've been here
since August last year.
And I've been here
since August last year.
And I've been here
since August last year.
At 21, she began a career
as a children's librarian,
At 21, she began a career
as a children's librarian,
At 21, she began a career
as a children's librarian,
starting off in a mobile library
in East London.
Starting off in a mobile library
in East London.
'I love working with children.
'You might remember on the last one,
I wanted to teach.'
'You might remember on the last one,
I wanted to teach.'
I've not stamped yours.
Sleeping Beauty.
Sleeping Beauty.
'Teaching children
the beauty of books
'Teaching children
the beauty of books
'Teaching children
the beauty of books
'and watching their faces as books
unfold to them is just fantastic.'
'and watching their faces as books
unfold to them is just fantastic.'
'and watching their faces as books
unfold to them is just fantastic.'
To work with children of that age,
you've gotta love them,
To work with children of that age,
you've gotta love them,
and I love children.
If I could,
I would have two girls and two boys.
If I could,
I would have two girls and two boys.
If I could,
I would have two girls and two boys.
I've been married a year
and... couple of months.
I've been married a year
and... couple of months.
I've been married a year
and... couple of months.
You do think,
"Christ, what have I done?"
You do think,
"Christ, what have I done?"
See, I've still got my...
And I'm being honest about it.
Yeah.
And Russ thinks the same.
You think... At times, you think,
"Christ, what have I done?"
You think... At times, you think,
"Christ, what have I done?"
When she was 19, she married Russ.
When she was 19, she married Russ.
They had two daughters,
Sarah and Emma.
They had two daughters,
Sarah and Emma.
'I'm very much geared
to the family unit.
'I'm very much geared
to the family unit.
'We do things together all the time.
'We do things together all the time.
'We flourished together.'
Where's the big rhinoceros?
'37 years. Gone extremely quickly.
'37 years. Gone extremely quickly.
'We've just grown together.'
By the time she was 35,
Lynn's mother had died.
By the time she was 35,
Lynn's mother had died.
She was a great friend to me,
as well as a mum.
She was a great friend to me,
as well as a mum.
Probably the best friend
I'll ever have.
And as you see, it still makes me
very emotional now.
And as you see, it still makes me
very emotional now.
It's only two years.
For some, it probably seems,
"Oh, it's a long time."
For some, it probably seems,
"Oh, it's a long time."
It's not very long.
'Because of cuts
in the education budget,
'Because of cuts
in the education budget,
'the mobile library was shut down.
'the mobile library was shut down.
'At 42, Lynn was working
at Bethnal Green Library.
'At 42, Lynn was working
at Bethnal Green Library.
'At 42, Lynn was working
at Bethnal Green Library.
'When we went back at 49,
she was still there.'
'When we went back at 49,
she was still there.'
When I last saw you,
I was telling you that
I didn't know if I'd have a job.
I was telling you that
I didn't know if I'd have a job.
I was telling you that
I didn't know if I'd have a job.
They finally told me,
"You're being made redundant."
They finally told me,
"You're being made redundant."
Got a story for you this morning.
Got a story for you this morning.
'Cutting departments again.
'Cutting departments again.
'Fortunately, at that time,
'I was over 50
and I could draw my pension.'
'I was over 50
and I could draw my pension.'
"silver bike."
It's been a hell of a commitment
for you, hasn't it?
It's been a hell of a commitment
for you, hasn't it?
Yeah.
And has it been worth it all?
And has it been worth it all?
Yeah. Very much. Very, very much.
Yeah. Very much. Very, very much.
BOY SHOUTS
BOY SHOUTS
'Bruce goes to
a private boarding school in Surrey.
'Bruce goes to
a private boarding school in Surrey.
'Bruce wants to be a missionary.'
'Bruce wants to be a missionary.'
I think the most important thing
in the world is
I think the most important thing
in the world is
everyone should know about God.
everyone should know about God.
When you were seven,
you wanted to be a missionary.
When you were seven,
you wanted to be a missionary.
Have you any thoughts on it?
No, I don't want to be a missionary
because I just can't talk
about it to people.
because I just can't talk
about it to people.
You know,
I'm interested in it myself,
You know,
I'm interested in it myself,
but I wouldn't be very good
at it at all.
but I wouldn't be very good
at it at all.
I am... about the only socialist
in my village,
I am... about the only socialist
in my village,
I am... about the only socialist
in my village,
and I go into the pub... and, er...
and I go into the pub... and, er...
..sort of expect to stand up
and defend all socialist policies.
..sort of expect to stand up
and defend all socialist policies.
..sort of expect to stand up
and defend all socialist policies.
Sort of, "This is
the village socialist?"
Sort of, "This is
the village socialist?"
"No, village idiot. Sorry."
"No, village idiot. Sorry."
"You agree
with all this immigration?"
So I stand up and defend it,
and it's awfully hard work.
So I stand up and defend it,
and it's awfully hard work.
I think I'm going to give that up.
'At 21, he was in his last year
at Oxford reading maths.'
'At 21, he was in his last year
at Oxford reading maths.'
'At 21, he was in his last year
at Oxford reading maths.'
..And by Eisenstein.
..And by Eisenstein.
You can show
that this is irreducible.
You can show
that this is irreducible.
T cubed plus 70 squared
plus 14 T plus seven equals...
T cubed plus 70 squared
plus 14 T plus seven equals...
T cubed plus 70 squared
plus 14 T plus seven equals...
I won't carry on with mathematics.
I don't think I'll be a teacher.
I won't carry on with mathematics.
I don't think I'll be a teacher.
Yes, sir.
'At 28, he was teaching -
immigrant children in East London.'
'At 28, he was teaching -
immigrant children in East London.'
'At 28, he was teaching -
immigrant children in East London.'
And to here.
it costs you 25...
It's so different from your own
education where you're teaching now.
It's so different from your own
education where you're teaching now.
Why?
I don't know whether I said,
"Right, I must do something which is
"against what I have been
brought up to do" or whatever.
"against what I have been
brought up to do" or whatever.
I don't know, I've just found
something I find rewarding.
I don't know, I've just found
something I find rewarding.
'At 35,
Bruce is working in Bangladesh.'
'At 35,
Bruce is working in Bangladesh.'
So, is this
your missionary dream come true?
So, is this
your missionary dream come true?
Well, not exactly.
I'm a teacher now in London,
I'm a teacher now in London,
and I've had the opportunity
to come here for a term.
and I've had the opportunity
to come here for a term.
And it just so happens
the school I am in
And it just so happens
the school I am in
has great links
with this part of the world.
has great links
with this part of the world.
And, you know, I've come here
to find out about the background
And, you know, I've come here
to find out about the background
And, you know, I've come here
to find out about the background
of many of the boys
that I teach back in London.
of many of the boys
that I teach back in London.
CHORAL SINGING
CHORAL SINGING
'At 49,
'he's teaching at Saint Albans,
a large boys' independent school.'
'he's teaching at Saint Albans,
a large boys' independent school.'
You've gotta get X on its own,
so what's the first thing we do?
You've gotta get X on its own,
so what's the first thing we do?
Multiply both sides by three.
You don't multiply by three.
Multiply both sides by three.
You don't multiply by three.
Divide by three, sorry.
Divide by three. OK.
Divide by three, sorry.
Divide by three. OK.
Tell me, then, what's exciting
about teaching here for you?
Tell me, then, what's exciting
about teaching here for you?
There is a higher academic level
to teach.
There is a higher academic level
to teach.
There is a higher academic level
to teach.
And then you can see
pupils at a more developed level.
And then you can see
pupils at a more developed level.
That flash of recognition
and then engendering their love
That flash of recognition
and then engendering their love
of the subject
that I had at their age.
of the subject
that I had at their age.
So, you're in the lead, you see,
because DSC Cabs...
So, you're in the lead, you see,
because DSC Cabs...
Has it been a kind of compromise of
political principles for you, this?
Has it been a kind of compromise of
political principles for you, this?
Has it been a kind of compromise of
political principles for you, this?
I just thought, "I don't think
I can do this till I'm 60,
I just thought, "I don't think
I can do this till I'm 60,
I just thought, "I don't think
I can do this till I'm 60,
"and therefore,
I'll have to do something else."
"and therefore,
I'll have to do something else."
Do your old friends give you
a hard time about what you've done?
Do your old friends give you
a hard time about what you've done?
They certainly do.
They absolutely do.
They certainly do.
They absolutely do.
They say, "Oh, you know,
have we joined the Tory party,
They say, "Oh, you know,
have we joined the Tory party,
"the golf club, the Masons?"
"the golf club, the Masons?"
Erm...
"You're driving a much better car
than you used to," and so on.
"You're driving a much better car
than you used to," and so on.
♪ Together
♪ Together
♪ Together. ♪
♪ Together. ♪
SINGING CONTINUES
SINGING CONTINUES
I've now retired completely.
I've now retired completely.
I start each day walking the dogs
on the beach.
I start each day walking the dogs
on the beach.
And then I do choir in the evening.
And then I do choir in the evening.
THEY SING
THEY SING
Oh, and on a Wednesday evening,
I tend to go to the lifeboat house
to do some training.
I tend to go to the lifeboat house
to do some training.
You know, I feel lucky.
I'm enjoying life probably more
than I have ever done.
I'm enjoying life probably more
than I have ever done.
I'm enjoying life probably more
than I have ever done.
I think what you want to do
is live a good life
I think what you want to do
is live a good life
and just whatever helps you do that.
and just whatever helps you do that.
My heart's desire is to see
my daddy,
My heart's desire is to see
my daddy,
who's 6,000 miles away.
who's 6,000 miles away.
There had been an estrangement
that was difficult to overcome.
There had been an estrangement
that was difficult to overcome.
There had been an estrangement
that was difficult to overcome.
But, you know,
he did say that he was proud of me
But, you know,
he did say that he was proud of me
cos he saw me on 28 Up,
I think, you know.
cos he saw me on 28 Up,
I think, you know.
And he just said, "Oh, I'm very
proud of what you're doing,"
And he just said, "Oh, I'm very
proud of what you're doing,"
and so on.
So, I discovered a photograph
that he must have sent to me
So, I discovered a photograph
that he must have sent to me
So, I discovered a photograph
that he must have sent to me
when I was about seven or eight,
when I was about seven or eight,
about the same age
as the first programme, saying,
about the same age
as the first programme, saying,
"This is a photograph of me so
you don't forget what I look like,"
"This is a photograph of me so
you don't forget what I look like,"
which is heartfelt,
together with a poem.
which is heartfelt,
together with a poem.
which is heartfelt,
together with a poem.
I've had it framed
with a picture of my dad.
I've had it framed
with a picture of my dad.
So, erm...
Anyway, this is a poem.
It was written in Christmas '64.
Anyway, this is a poem.
It was written in Christmas '64.
"To Bruce.
"To Bruce.
"You were a tiny infant once
"You were a tiny infant once
"Near death in oxygen and cradle
"Near death in oxygen and cradle
"Your life was scarcely worth the
price of one weak flickering candle
"Your life was scarcely worth the
price of one weak flickering candle
"Your life was scarcely worth the
price of one weak flickering candle
"Today, you're a steadfast boy
Seeking and exploring
"Today, you're a steadfast boy
Seeking and exploring
"Today, you're a steadfast boy
Seeking and exploring
"Today, you bring undreamt of joy
To a distant heart now aching
"Today, you bring undreamt of joy
To a distant heart now aching
"Today, you bring undreamt of joy
To a distant heart now aching
"May God ne'er give you
Wealth unearned
"Nor give you love unbought
"Nor give you love unbought
"God give you courage
with wisdom learned
"God give you courage
with wisdom learned
"To dare all things you ought
"To dare all things you ought
"As proud as any father was
"As proud as any father was
"Since life since began
"Since life since began
"I claim that
All the world shall know
"I claim that
All the world shall know
"My son, my Bruce, a man."
"My son, my Bruce, a man."
'Symon was brought up
in a children's home,
'Symon was brought up
in a children's home,
'the only child of a single parent.'
'the only child of a single parent.'
They say,
"Where's your father, then?
They say,
"Where's your father, then?
"You know, when your mum's
out at work, where's your father?"
"You know, when your mum's
out at work, where's your father?"
And I just tell 'em I ain't got one.
What effect has that had on you?
Well, I don't think
it's had any effect on me cos...
Well, I don't think
it's had any effect on me cos...
..what you don't have,
you don't miss, and...
..what you don't have,
you don't miss, and...
When... You were illegitimate -
When... You were illegitimate -
does this make you
particularly nervous
does this make you
particularly nervous
of you having an illegitimate child?
I mean,
does it colour your attitude to that
I mean,
does it colour your attitude to that
or what are
your feelings about that?
It doesn't worry me in the least.
You know?
Well, we're living
in different times.
Well, we're living
in different times.
I mean, 20 years ago...
..when I was born, you know,
an illegitimate child, you know,
..when I was born, you know,
an illegitimate child, you know,
that's something
that's only whispered about.
that's something
that's only whispered about.
People, you know, feel strongly
about it in those days,
People, you know, feel strongly
about it in those days,
but nowadays, it's...
but nowadays, it's...
..it's not a serious matter.
I was gonna be a film star, but...
I was gonna be a film star, but...
..now I'm gonna be
an electrical engineer,
..now I'm gonna be
an electrical engineer,
which is more to reality, really.
'By 21, Symon was working
in the freezer room
'By 21, Symon was working
in the freezer room
'of Walls Sausages in London.'
Do you never feel you should
be doing better jobs than these?
Do you never feel you should
be doing better jobs than these?
Aren't you worth more than this?
No, I haven't, really.
I suppose I just like hard work,
I don't know.
I suppose I just like hard work,
I don't know.
But, er...
It's never really
sort of worried me.
It's never really
sort of worried me.
I suppose it should,
but it just hasn't.
I suppose it should,
but it just hasn't.
'Since then, he has worked near
Heathrow Airport, handling freight.'
'Since then, he has worked near
Heathrow Airport, handling freight.'
Do you feel you could have done more
with a career, with your work?
Do you feel you could have done more
with a career, with your work?
Do you feel you could have done more
with a career, with your work?
If I'd pushed myself at school,
If I'd pushed myself at school,
probably, I could have done
a lot better.
probably, I could have done
a lot better.
Does that give you
pause for thought?
Does that give you
pause for thought?
No. That means I was a lazy sod
when I was younger.
No. That means I was a lazy sod
when I was younger.
Tell me,
do you have any girlfriends?
Tell me,
do you have any girlfriends?
Well, not many.
What do you think about girls?
Oh, not much.
'By 28, he had married Yvonne,
and they had five children.'
'By 28, he had married Yvonne,
and they had five children.'
'By 28, he had married Yvonne,
and they had five children.'
What would you like to give
your children that you never had?
What would you like to give
your children that you never had?
They've got everything.
They've got everything.
They've even got what I never had.
They've even got what I never had.
So...
Which is what?
A father, innit?
So, I mean, they've had everything.
A father, innit?
So, I mean, they've had everything.
'By 35, they were divorced.'
'By 35, they were divorced.'
CHATTERING
CHATTERING
'By the time he was 42,
Symon had married Vienetta.
'By the time he was 42,
Symon had married Vienetta.
'Vienetta already had a daughter,
Miriam.
'Vienetta already had a daughter,
Miriam.
'And she and Symon had a son,
Daniel.'
'And she and Symon had a son,
Daniel.'
What's the biggest influence
Vienetta has on you?
What's the biggest influence
Vienetta has on you?
I think really motivation
because before,
I never really pushed myself.
because before,
I never really pushed myself.
because before,
I never really pushed myself.
She looks after me.
She looks after me.
She doesn't just push me,
she looks after me.
She doesn't just push me,
she looks after me.
You know, she would never let
anything be wrong for me.
You know, she would never let
anything be wrong for me.
She always makes sure that if I go
down the road, I look all right.
She always makes sure that if I go
down the road, I look all right.
She always makes sure that if I go
down the road, I look all right.
If I go anywhere,
I look all right, you know?
If I go anywhere,
I look all right, you know?
If I go anywhere,
I look all right, you know?
And I do the right thing.
And I do the right thing.
And it makes me feel that
And it makes me feel that
there's somebody out there
that really, really wants me.
there's somebody out there
that really, really wants me.
there's somebody out there
that really, really wants me.
Obviously,
when children come into foster care,
family and friends
are involved as well,
and we have to ensure
that the children are...
'By 49, Symon and Vienetta had
decided to train as foster parents.'
'By 49, Symon and Vienetta had
decided to train as foster parents.'
'By 49, Symon and Vienetta had
decided to train as foster parents.'
And we always say to foster carers,
please do not cut
the children's hair
without the permission
of the parents.
without the permission
of the parents.
'So, what's the toughest thing
about being a foster parent?'
'So, what's the toughest thing
about being a foster parent?'
You're taking a chance, really,
when you do it cos you don't...
You're taking a chance, really,
when you do it cos you don't...
You really don't know
what you're getting.
One child had two knives in her hand
One child had two knives in her hand
because she didn't want to stay
in this country.
because she didn't want to stay
in this country.
Two knives in her hands.
She threatened you?
Two knives in her hands.
She threatened you?
No, she was just a threat
to herself.
No, she was just a threat
to herself.
Some of them will even go
into independent care,
Some of them will even go
into independent care,
but then they can come back
at any time.
Thank you so much for everything.
She's a bit emotional.
I know.
'They ring you up and say,
' "Hello, Aunty, hello, Uncle.
How are you?" '
They come and have Sunday dinner,
come and visit us, which is good.
They come and have Sunday dinner,
come and visit us, which is good.
At least you know
you've made a little difference
At least you know
you've made a little difference
to that child or that person's life.
Were you looked after at some point?
Were you looked after at some point?
My real mother died at birth,
and my dad remarried,
My real mother died at birth,
and my dad remarried,
My real mother died at birth,
and my dad remarried,
and my mother made me
the person I am today
cos she was always helping
other young people.
cos she was always helping
other young people.
And she used to always say to us,
"Don't be jealous,
And she used to always say to us,
"Don't be jealous,
"cos you've got my love, but
they've got no-one to love them."
"cos you've got my love, but
they've got no-one to love them."
You know?
CHATTERING,
UPBEAT MUSIC
CHATTERING,
UPBEAT MUSIC
Well done.
'The social services
sent us a report in,
'The social services
sent us a report in,
'listing all the people
that we looked after.'
'listing all the people
that we looked after.'
And it came to about 130.
And it came to about 130.
And we...
we just couldn't believe that.
And we...
we just couldn't believe that.
MUSIC PLAYS,
CHATTERING
MUSIC PLAYS,
CHATTERING
We had all sorts.
Some from this country.
We had all sorts.
Some from this country.
We had all sorts.
Some from this country.
White kids from this country,
Black kids from this country,
White kids from this country,
Black kids from this country,
mixed race kids from this country.
mixed race kids from this country.
We had kids from Africa,
from the Caribbean,
We had kids from Africa,
from the Caribbean,
from... Well, actually,
all the way around the world
from... Well, actually,
all the way around the world
when I think about it.
♪ I love you more than my life. ♪
♪ I love you more than my life. ♪
The police are involved sometimes
The police are involved sometimes
because of whatever trouble
they've come from.
because of whatever trouble
they've come from.
They say, "Would it be all right
to bring somebody round?
They say, "Would it be all right
to bring somebody round?
They say, "Would it be all right
to bring somebody round?
"We know it's cheeky," and all this,
but we normally say yes
"We know it's cheeky," and all this,
but we normally say yes
cos you're not saying no
to the police,
you're saying no to the child.
'What sort of life
does your mother have?'
'What sort of life
does your mother have?'
It always seems hard.
I mean, she's always been nervous.
It always seems hard.
I mean, she's always been nervous.
She has periods of depression.
She has periods of depression.
It's made me very sort of protective
towards her.
It's made me very sort of protective
towards her.
I feel I've got to help her
all the time.
I feel I've got to help her
all the time.
She died in 1990.
She had cancer,
and she didn't survive
all the stuff that was doing to her.
and she didn't survive
all the stuff that was doing to her.
and she didn't survive
all the stuff that was doing to her.
Is that tough?
Yeah, for me,
because there were so many things
Yeah, for me,
because there were so many things
I never actually said to my mum
I never actually said to my mum
that... I would have liked to say
to her.
that... I would have liked to say
to her.
You know?
Just things that, you know,
you think about afterwards,
Just things that, you know,
you think about afterwards,
it's too late
because they're not there any more.
it's too late
because they're not there any more.
What sort of things?
Well...
What sort of things?
Well...
Just "I love you" every day,
you know?
What colour are they?
Gold.
What colour are they?
Gold.
'It's still in my head now.
'It's still in my head now.
'I should have asked,
firstly, who is my dad?
'I should have asked,
firstly, who is my dad?
'What did he do?'
Where did he come from?
I... can't remember who told me
he was Nigerian.
I... can't remember who told me
he was Nigerian.
I... can't remember who told me
he was Nigerian.
It might have been my mum, but
I don't know that he was Nigerian.
It might have been my mum, but
I don't know that he was Nigerian.
It might have been my mum, but
I don't know that he was Nigerian.
So I know nothing about the man.
I never saw him.
So I know nothing about the man.
I never saw him.
And...
that's a lot of big noughts...
that's a lot of big noughts...
..and I...
SIGHS
I shouldn't have worried
about upsetting people.
I shouldn't have worried
about upsetting people.
I should have just asked
the question.
That's what I think now.
At the time,
I didn't wanna upset anyone.
At the time,
I didn't wanna upset anyone.
At the time,
I didn't wanna upset anyone.
And I didn't know who to ask
so I didn't.
And I didn't know who to ask
so I didn't.
But now I wish to hell I had.
But now I wish to hell I had.
Yeah.
Tell me, do you have any boyfriends,
Suzy?
Tell me, do you have any boyfriends,
Suzy?
Erm... Yes.
Erm... Yes.
Tell me about him.
Well, he lives up in Scotland,
and he's... I think he's 13.
Well, he lives up in Scotland,
and he's... I think he's 13.
Well, he lives up in Scotland,
and he's... I think he's 13.
Well, once Carolyn Tedford said
she was... she loved me.
Well, once Carolyn Tedford said
she was... she loved me.
Well, once Carolyn Tedford said
she was... she loved me.
What do you think about that?
And I... And I'm going to marry...
marry her when I grow up.
And I... And I'm going to marry...
marry her when I grow up.
I hate her, she's always getting
bad-tempered and cross with me.
I hate her, she's always getting
bad-tempered and cross with me.
Is she?
Yeah, she says,
"Neil Hughes,
move your desk forward."
"Neil Hughes,
move your desk forward."
Well, I don't know what sort of boy,
but I think one that...
Well, I don't know what sort of boy,
but I think one that...
Well, I don't know what sort of boy,
but I think one that...
So...
So...
That's not got a lot of money
but is... has got some money.
That's not got a lot of money
but is... has got some money.
That's not got a lot of money
but is... has got some money.
Not a lot.
But when boys go round with girls,
they don't pay attention
to what they're doing.
they don't pay attention
to what they're doing.
My grandmother had an accident
My grandmother had an accident
because a boyfriend was kissing
his girlfriend in the street.
because a boyfriend was kissing
his girlfriend in the street.
because a boyfriend was kissing
his girlfriend in the street.
When I get married,
I'd like to have two children.
When I get married,
I'd like to have two children.
Would you like to have
a nanny to look after them
Would you like to have
a nanny to look after them
or do you want to look after them?
No, I want
a nanny to look after them.
No, I want
a nanny to look after them.
My girlfriend... is in Africa,
and I won't...
My girlfriend... is in Africa,
and I won't...
My girlfriend... is in Africa,
and I won't...
I don't think I'll have
another chance of seeing her again.
I don't think I'll have
another chance of seeing her again.
If we did all love Jeffrey,
and we all want to marry him...
If we did all love Jeffrey,
and we all want to marry him...
If we did all love Jeffrey,
and we all want to marry him...
Yeah!
..I think I know
the one that he likes best,
and that's her.
But Susan most of all likes Lesley.
But Susan most of all likes Lesley.
She told me before.
Do I?
She said.
She keeps changing her mind, though.
She said.
She keeps changing her mind, though.
Yeah.
I don't know which one, really.
Yeah.
I don't know which one, really.
So, do you think you knew
enough men or knew enough about men
So, do you think you knew
enough men or knew enough about men
to make a decision at this
fairly young age to get married?
to make a decision at this
fairly young age to get married?
to make a decision at this
fairly young age to get married?
The two of you who are married
and the one of you
who is looking for a husband?
And the one of you
who is looking for a husband?
Oh, don't say that!
I'm not out looking for a husband.
Oh, don't say that!
I'm not out looking for a husband.
But you would like to be married?
Wouldn't everybody?
What a ridiculous question!
Wouldn't everybody?
What a ridiculous question!
I'm not looking
for someone to get married...
Am I looking for someone?
No, I'm not looking
for someone to get married, so.
No, I'm not looking
for someone to get married, so.
Are you putting an advert in the
paper, "Husband desperately needed."
Are you putting an advert in the
paper, "Husband desperately needed."
Yeah, I'm not desperate.
"Please help.
"I'm desperate, I'm desperate."
I mean...
"I'm desperate, I'm desperate."
I mean...
No, I think
when Sue finds the right person,
No, I think
when Sue finds the right person,
then that's it.
I mean, it takes a while.
No, it just means
a different thing to me.
I've still got
my ideals about marriage.
I don't know what it's all about,
obviously.
So I've still got pictures
of cosy evenings indoors...
So I've still got pictures
of cosy evenings indoors...
OVERLAPPING DIALOGUE
Yeah, I mean...
Cosy evenings indoors
with central heating.
Cosy evenings indoors
with central heating.
Yeah.
Or lack of it.
I've got a lot to learn about...
'Sue was 24 when she married Billy,
and they had two children.'
'Sue was 24 when she married Billy,
and they had two children.'
'Sue was 24 when she married Billy,
and they had two children.'
To get married young,
there must be things that you miss.
To get married young,
there must be things that you miss.
You must miss that crucial stage
of being yourself.
You must miss that crucial stage
of being yourself.
Because the minute you get married,
you're no longer a single being.
Because the minute you get married,
you're no longer a single being.
Because the minute you get married,
you're no longer a single being.
You're a partnership, and
that should be the idea behind it.
You're a partnership, and
that should be the idea behind it.
'By the time Sue was 35,
she was divorced.'
'By the time Sue was 35,
she was divorced.'
'By the time Sue was 35,
she was divorced.'
I've never sat down and thought,
"Well, what was it?
I've never sat down and thought,
"Well, what was it?
"Was it this, was it that?"
I just knew it wasn't working.
"Was it this, was it that?"
I just knew it wasn't working.
I'm with someone now, which is nice.
It feels right.
I'm with someone now, which is nice.
It feels right.
But it's early days yet.
♪ Long ago
♪ Long ago
♪ Long ago
♪ And oh, so far away
♪ And oh, so far away
♪ I fell in love with you
♪ I fell in love with you
♪ I fell in love with you
♪ Before the second show. ♪
♪ Before the second show. ♪
♪ Before the second show. ♪
'She brought Glen along
to watch her sing.'
'She brought Glen along
to watch her sing.'
♪ It sounds so sweet
♪ It sounds so sweet
♪ But you're not really here... ♪
♪ But you're not really here... ♪
We've been together now
over 20 years.
We've been together now
over 20 years.
Still not married. Never say never.
Still not married. Never say never.
But no plans.
♪ Don't you remember
♪ You told me you loved me, baby?
♪ You told me you loved me, baby?
♪ You told me you loved me, baby?
♪ Said you'd be coming
Back this way again, baby
♪ Said you'd be coming
Back this way again, baby
♪ Said you'd be coming
Back this way again, baby
♪ Baby, baby, baby, baby
Oh, baby
♪ Baby, baby, baby, baby
Oh, baby
♪ Baby, baby, baby, baby
Oh, baby
♪ I love you
♪ I love you
♪ I really do. ♪
♪ I really do. ♪
Glen has decided that...
he's fed up being on the longest
engagement of all time,
he's fed up being on the longest
engagement of all time,
so he asked me to marry him
on the beach in Goa.
so he asked me to marry him
on the beach in Goa.
"Will you marry me?" in the sand
and bought me a ring.
"Will you marry me?" in the sand
and bought me a ring.
"Will you marry me?" in the sand
and bought me a ring.
Another ring!
Two engagement rings I've got now.
Two engagement rings I've got now.
And, yeah, so it was
very, very romantic, very lovely.
And, yeah, so it was
very, very romantic, very lovely.
Couldn't have wanted
a better wedding, really.
Couldn't have wanted
a better wedding, really.
♪ What to say... ♪
♪ What to say... ♪
When I was singing on the karaoke,
when I'd just got with Glen
When I was singing on the karaoke,
when I'd just got with Glen
and he's standing at the bar,
and he's standing at the bar,
and Michael's voice
come over the camera, and he said...
and Michael's voice
come over the camera, and he said...
'She brought Glen along
to watch her sing.'
'She brought Glen along
to watch her sing.'
And Glen's looking like that,
all proud.
And Glen's looking like that,
all proud.
He absolutely hates it.
He absolutely hates it.
♪ Don't you remember
♪ You told me you love me, baby? ♪
♪ You told me you love me, baby? ♪
'Sue had a series of office jobs.
'Sue had a series of office jobs.
'She now helps run the MA courses
'in the legal faculty
of the University of London.'
'in the legal faculty
of the University of London.'
Realistically, this is the points
you really do have to consider.
Realistically, this is the points
you really do have to consider.
Realistically, this is the points
you really do have to consider.
You can't do two modules that are
taught at the same time, obviously.
You can't do two modules that are
taught at the same time, obviously.
'And then I retired very recently.'
'And then I retired very recently.'
And here I am now at home,
And here I am now at home,
And here I am now at home,
trying to find myself
something new to do.
trying to find myself
something new to do.
It's really quite hard.
I didn't think
retirement would be this hard,
I didn't think
retirement would be this hard,
but I find it quite...
but I find it quite...
I don't know, I just feel
a bit lost sometimes, you know?
I don't know, I just feel
a bit lost sometimes, you know?
So I need to find myself
a new direction or something.
So I need to find myself
a new direction or something.
It's a nice one, isn't it?
'After the wedding, we lost Dad.'
'After the wedding, we lost Dad.'
The first time we seen him, innit?
The first time we seen him, innit?
'Two years later,
Boxing Day, we lost my mum.'
'Two years later,
Boxing Day, we lost my mum.'
So, yeah, it's been a tough...
So, yeah, it's been a tough...
So, yeah, it's been a tough...
It's been a roller coaster,
this seven years.
It's been a roller coaster,
this seven years.
So most seven-year periods,
you think, "What have I done?"
So most seven-year periods,
you think, "What have I done?"
You know, I've done nothing
in the last seven years.
You know, I've done nothing
in the last seven years.
"What on Earth
am I gonna talk about?"
But this seven years, wow.
It's been... It's been really busy
and really highs and lows.
It's been... It's been really busy
and really highs and lows.
It's been... It's been really busy
and really highs and lows.
I mean, I suppose my life,
compared to a lot of people,
has been really quite predictable.
compared to a lot of people,
has been really quite predictable.
When I was a child,
you saw me saying
I was gonna go to this school
and that university.
I was gonna go to this school
and that university.
And that all happened.
When I leave this school,
I go to Charterhouse.
When I leave this school,
I go to Charterhouse.
And after that...
And after that...
Trinity Hall, Cambridge.
Trinity Hall, Cambridge.
I made several blunders on 7 Up.
I made several blunders on 7 Up.
For instance,
I said I was going to Trinity Hall
instead of Trinity College.
I said I was going to Trinity Hall
instead of Trinity College.
They didn't like that too much,
nor did my father.
They didn't like that too much,
nor did my father.
And I've had
a fairly conventional career.
And I've had
a fairly conventional career.
And I've had
a fairly conventional career.
I haven't had a lot, you know,
I haven't had a lot
of disappointments or setbacks.
I haven't had a lot
of disappointments or setbacks.
I'd like to be a solicitor
and also fairly successful.
I'd like to be a solicitor
and also fairly successful.
I'd like to be a solicitor
and also fairly successful.
'Andrew is a solicitor, working
for a large firm in the city.'
'Andrew is a solicitor, working
for a large firm in the city.'
'Andrew is a solicitor, working
for a large firm in the city.'
What qualities do you think
it needs to be successful?
What qualities do you think
it needs to be successful?
Well, you have to have a legal
ability in my business, obviously,
Well, you have to have a legal
ability in my business, obviously,
Well, you have to have a legal
ability in my business, obviously,
and you have to have
a sort of bedside manner
as far as your clients
are concerned.
I was an in-house lawyer
for an industrial gases company.
I was an in-house lawyer
for an industrial gases company.
I was an in-house lawyer
for an industrial gases company.
And I retired since our last film.
And I retired since our last film.
It took me quite a while
to get used to being retired.
It took me quite a while
to get used to being retired.
I did miss the sort of camaraderie
of being with other people.
I did miss the sort of camaraderie
of being with other people.
I did miss the sort of camaraderie
of being with other people.
But after a while, I got used to it.
But after a while, I got used to it.
And obviously, it lets us do things
that we couldn't do
And obviously, it lets us do things
that we couldn't do
for the 40 years I was working.
for the 40 years I was working.
What do you think
about girlfriends at your age?
What do you think
about girlfriends at your age?
Tell me what you think
about girlfriends.
I've got one,
but I don't think much of her.
I've got one,
but I don't think much of her.
The girls never, never, never do
what the boys want them.
The girls never, never, never do
what the boys want them.
The girls never, never, never do
what the boys want them.
They always start playing with dolls
They always start playing with dolls
when the boys want to play
rough and tumble with them.
when the boys want to play
rough and tumble with them.
It's quite true.
I don't think I financially come
from the same background.
I don't think I financially come
from the same background.
Hm.
Andrew didn't go for a haughty deb.
He went for a good Yorkshire lass.
Andrew didn't go for a haughty deb.
He went for a good Yorkshire lass.
But I mean, obviously,
he knew what he wanted.
But I mean, obviously,
he knew what he wanted.
Looking back, I would have liked
to have spent a bit more time
Looking back, I would have liked
to have spent a bit more time
with the family, you know,
rather than giving
so much priority to work.
rather than giving
so much priority to work.
When you're young
and trying to make your career,
When you're young
and trying to make your career,
it all seems terribly important
to you
to spend that extra few hours
at the office.
to spend that extra few hours
at the office.
to spend that extra few hours
at the office.
But in the scheme of things,
it probably would have been better
But in the scheme of things,
it probably would have been better
to, you know, go to the school play
or the sports day or whatever.
to, you know, go to the school play
or the sports day or whatever.
to, you know, go to the school play
or the sports day or whatever.
I think all the success in the world
in your career...
I think all the success in the world
in your career...
I think all the success in the world
in your career...
is unimportant
compared to, you know,
is unimportant
compared to, you know,
having a close and loving family,
really... which I hope we have.
having a close and loving family,
really... which I hope we have.
having a close and loving family,
really... which I hope we have.
In this job, we must always
be prepared to take risks.
In this job, we must always
be prepared to take risks.
In this job, we must always
be prepared to take risks.
♪ HEAVY METAL
Woah!
We are the face
that people look to for reassurance.
We are the face
that people look to for reassurance.
Think there's a way of doing this
without looking ridiculous?
Think there's a way of doing this
without looking ridiculous?
Time to see what you're made of.
Watch every episode now
on STV Player.
Watch every episode now
on STV Player.
'In the headmistress's study
of a fashionable school for girls,
'In the headmistress's study
of a fashionable school for girls,
'In the headmistress's study
of a fashionable school for girls,
'we met Suzy.'
'we met Suzy.'
I'm down for Heathfield
and Southover Manor.
I'm down for Heathfield
and Southover Manor.
And then maybe I may...
I may want to go to a university,
but I don't know which one yet.
I may want to go to a university,
but I don't know which one yet.
I may want to go to a university,
but I don't know which one yet.
'Suzy lives in Scotland
on her father's 4,000-acre estate.'
'Suzy lives in Scotland
on her father's 4,000-acre estate.'
There's always
something to do here.
I mean, I'm never, ever bored.
What sort of things do you do?
What sort of things do you do?
Erm...
Ride, swim,
play tennis.
Ping pong.
And I might play croquet.
Anything like that.
What about the social life?
What's that?
What about the social life?
What's that?
What, in Perthshire?
Yeah.
Hm, it's quite fun.
There are lots of things going on.
There are lots of things going on.
I think your dog's got a rabbit.
I think your dog's got a rabbit.
What are you gonna do?
Do you wanna try and save it?
Max! Bring it here.
Do you wanna try and save it?
Max! Bring it here.
Oh, disgusting dog!
That's the second one you've given,
the second week.
That's the second one you've given,
the second week.
Does that worry you?
No, not at all.
Does that worry you?
No, not at all.
Why doesn't it worry you that
things should have to be k*lled?
Why doesn't it worry you that
things should have to be k*lled?
I suppose
I've been brought up to it.
I suppose
I've been brought up to it.
'I left school when I was 16,
went to Paris.
'I left school when I was 16,
went to Paris.
'Ah... Went to secretarial college
and got a job.'
'Ah... Went to secretarial college
and got a job.'
What made you decide to leave school
and go to Paris?
What made you decide to leave school
and go to Paris?
I just wasn't interested in school
and just wanted to get away.
I just wasn't interested in school
and just wanted to get away.
I mean, your parents split up
soon after you were 14.
Mm-hm.
Soon after you were 14.
Mm-hm.
Has that... What sort of influence,
effect, did that have on you?
Has that... What sort of influence,
effect, did that have on you?
Has that... What sort of influence,
effect, did that have on you?
Well, I was the only child
going through their parents
splitting up aged 14.
going through their parents
splitting up aged 14.
What a very vulnerable age.
And it does...
And it does cut you up.
And it does...
And it does cut you up.
But... you know, you get over it.
But... you know, you get over it.
There's no point...
There's no point in them
staying together for me
There's no point in them
staying together for me
because it was worse,
I mean, the rows,
and I don't sort of sit down and
think, you know, analyse marriage.
and I don't sort of sit down and
think, you know, analyse marriage.
and I don't sort of sit down and
think, you know, analyse marriage.
It's not something
I've had to come up and think about
It's not something
I've had to come up and think about
or that I was gonna get married,
and I've got no desire to
at the moment.
and I've got no desire to
at the moment.
I think 20's far too young.
I think 20's far too young.
When I last saw you at 21,
you were nervous.
When I last saw you at 21,
you were nervous.
You were chain-smoking,
you were uptight.
You were chain-smoking,
you were uptight.
And now you seem happy.
And now you seem happy.
What's happened to you
over these last seven years?
What's happened to you
over these last seven years?
I suppose Rupert.
I suppose Rupert.
I'll give you some credit.
Thank you.
I'll give you some credit.
Thank you.
I'm now chain-smoking.
I'm now chain-smoking.
I suppose
I suppose
I felt it was the right time.
I felt it was the right time.
I don't see what I would have gained
by waiting another three years.
I don't see what I would have gained
by waiting another three years.
Mummy?
Yeah?
Laura wants you.
'Very little has changed.
Laura wants you.
'Very little has changed.
'My life probably is
very much the same as it was then.
'My life probably is
very much the same as it was then.
'I've had another baby.
'We've moved house,
and that's about all.
'We've moved house,
and that's about all.
'I hope by Rupert and I giving them
a close family unit,
'I hope by Rupert and I giving them
a close family unit,
'I hope by Rupert and I giving them
a close family unit,
'that they'll keep their heads
and won't feel
'that they'll keep their heads
and won't feel
'that they're slightly lost
like I did.
'that they're slightly lost
like I did.
'Where I wasted time was
in my middle-late teens,
'Where I wasted time was
in my middle-late teens,
'and I think
at that stage, I didn't care.'
'and I think
at that stage, I didn't care.'
I just let those years go,
really, I drifted.
I just let those years go,
really, I drifted.
The more she went through the
stages, the bigger the space became.
The more she went through the
stages, the bigger the space became.
The more she went through the
stages, the bigger the space became.
But the actual grief...
Doesn't go away.
But the actual grief...
Doesn't go away.
Doesn't actually go away, ever.
But just...
'I got into bereavement counselling
about four years ago.
'I got into bereavement counselling
about four years ago.
'I got into bereavement counselling
about four years ago.
It's an extraordinary experience
when you meet someone
It's an extraordinary experience
when you meet someone
who is suffering terribly...
and over the months,
who is suffering terribly...
and over the months,
who is suffering terribly...
and over the months,
you see them move on.
You see them get their life
back together again.
You see them get their life
back together again.
That's gonna be a foul.
It's gone right over!
Another one.
It's gone right over!
Another one.
Maybe now is...
Maybe now is...
the first time that I actually feel
happy within my own skin.
the first time that I actually feel
happy within my own skin.
the first time that I actually feel
happy within my own skin.
It's taken me a long time...
to do it.
It's taken me a long time...
to do it.
I threw away my education,
and I've always regretted that.
I threw away my education,
and I've always regretted that.
I threw away my education,
and I've always regretted that.
But you can't turn the clock back.
But you can't turn the clock back.
Life throws some curveballs
sometimes,
Life throws some curveballs
sometimes,
and you have to negotiate
your way through as best you can.
and you have to negotiate
your way through as best you can.
and you have to negotiate
your way through as best you can.
Er... Yeah.
I mean, my life's been...
Obviously, I've had some difficult
times, some upsetting times.
Obviously, I've had some difficult
times, some upsetting times.
Obviously, I've had some difficult
times, some upsetting times.
But... you learn to grow with them.
But... you learn to grow with them.
I've had a very privileged life
compared to some people.
I've had a very privileged life
compared to some people.
I've never really had
to struggle to make my way.
I've never really had
to struggle to make my way.
I've never really had
to struggle to make my way.
But I don't think I've taken
for granted what I've had either.
But I don't think I've taken
for granted what I've had either.
This may sound very arrogant,
but you can't...
This may sound very arrogant,
but you can't...
I can't change what I was born into.
I can't change what I was born into.
'We chose two boys
from a children's home in Middlesex.
'We chose two boys
from a children's home in Middlesex.
'Paul left the children's home
when he was eight.'
'Paul left the children's home
when he was eight.'
Well, I don't...
I don't like, erm...
Well, I don't...
I don't like, erm...
the big boys hitting us
the big boys hitting us
and the prefects sending us out,
out for nothing.
and the prefects sending us out,
out for nothing.
and the prefects sending us out,
out for nothing.
'He went to Australia
to start a new life.'
'He went to Australia
to start a new life.'
What do you remember of England?
It seemed to be raining
all the time.
I wouldn't stake my life on it,
I wouldn't stake my life on it,
but...
cos I can't remember very much.
but...
cos I can't remember very much.
I find it hard to express emotion
most of the time,
I find it hard to express emotion
most of the time,
although I'm getting on top of that.
although I'm getting on top of that.
More now, you know?
More now, you know?
I mean, just a simple thing
to say to sort of Susan,
I mean, just a simple thing
to say to sort of Susan,
you know, "I love you"
or something like that.
Things have fallen into line there
now for me.
Things have fallen into line there
now for me.
Everything's started to come good.
Everything's started to come good.
I've started to enjoy life.
And I've started to think,
"Well, you know,
I'm not a no hoper."
"Well, you know,
I'm not a no hoper."
Because really, I think that's what
I've always thought about myself.
Because really, I think that's what
I've always thought about myself.
I know I didn't have
any confidence in myself.
I know I didn't have
any confidence in myself.
What was it that you fell in love
with? What is it about him?
What was it that you fell in love
with? What is it about him?
His helplessness, I suppose.
It was the motherly instinct in me
to pick him up and cuddle him.
It was the motherly instinct in me
to pick him up and cuddle him.
And he's also very good-looking,
I think.
But he doesn't agree with me.
But he doesn't agree with me.
And in the summer, he's got
this cute little bum in shorts.
And in the summer, he's got
this cute little bum in shorts.
Would you like to get married, Paul?
Would you like to get married, Paul?
I don't like 'em.
I don't like 'em.
Say, you had a wife, they...
Say, you had a wife, they...
Say, you had a wife, they...
Say you had to eat
what they cooked you
Say you had to eat
what they cooked you
and say, I don't like greens,
and say, I don't like greens,
well, I don't, and say she said,
well, I don't, and say she said,
well, I don't, and say she said,
"You have to eat what you get give."
"You have to eat what you get give."
So I don't like greens,
So I don't like greens,
say she gives me greens,
and that's it.
say she gives me greens,
and that's it.
He...
I suppose it's really made me go
to jelly inside,
I suppose it's really made me go
to jelly inside,
you know, to see him like that.
you know, to see him like that.
Is confidence still an issue
with you?
Yeah. Yeah. Unfortunately.
I've learned to live with it.
Yeah. Yeah. Unfortunately.
I've learned to live with it.
Sort of accept it.
But I had never really got
on top of it fully,
But I had never really got
on top of it fully,
which is... It really annoys me.
which is... It really annoys me.
I don't know
what to do about it, though.
I don't know
what to do about it, though.
I've never been told properly ever.
I've never been told properly ever.
But the whole reason why
I was at the boarding school
But the whole reason why
I was at the boarding school
is because there was a fairly
messy divorce case happening.
is because there was a fairly
messy divorce case happening.
is because there was a fairly
messy divorce case happening.
My dad ended up with custody of us,
and we moved away,
My dad ended up with custody of us,
and we moved away,
My dad ended up with custody of us,
and we moved away,
and it was just my dad and
then my stepmother and my brother.
and it was just my dad and
then my stepmother and my brother.
and it was just my dad and
then my stepmother and my brother.
I asked my dad
when I was quite young about family,
I asked my dad
when I was quite young about family,
and he said, "Your family
begins and ends with me."
and he said, "Your family
begins and ends with me."
I didn't have any contact
with my mother until I was 21.
I didn't have any contact
with my mother until I was 21.
I didn't have any contact
with my mother until I was 21.
And she wrote me a letter.
And she wrote me a letter.
So, she came out and visited,
and at the airport,
So, she came out and visited,
and at the airport,
So, she came out and visited,
and at the airport,
I could have easily walked past her
and not even known her.
I could have easily walked past her
and not even known her.
It used to be.
Really?
Yeah.
'At 21, we took Paul and Symon
round the buildings
'At 21, we took Paul and Symon
round the buildings
'which were once
the children's home.'
I remember this part, but
I remember when they were cleaner.
I remember this part, but
I remember when they were cleaner.
I remember this part, but
I remember when they were cleaner.
Them are the two offices.
Yeah. Doctors and the nurses.
Them are the two offices.
Yeah. Doctors and the nurses.
Are the refs all ex-players or what?
Are the refs all ex-players or what?
No, some of 'em are trained for it,
like, you know.
No, some of 'em are trained for it,
like, you know.
One thing the show did is because we
had to come back here a few times,
One thing the show did is because we
had to come back here a few times,
One thing the show did is because we
had to come back here a few times,
the show brought my mother and I
back together.
the show brought my mother and I
back together.
Through that, we also met
some of her side of the family.
Through that, we also met
some of her side of the family.
They were just such lovely people.
They were just such lovely people.
It was sad that
I didn't grow up knowing them.
It was sad that
I didn't grow up knowing them.
I definitely believe that
the family's 100% the main thing.
I definitely believe that
the family's 100% the main thing.
I definitely believe that
the family's 100% the main thing.
I definitely believe that
the family's 100% the main thing.
It doesn't matter what you earn,
what you do,
It doesn't matter what you earn,
what you do,
you need a good family nucleus.
you need a good family nucleus.
You need it for yourself.
You need it for your life
to make your life whole.
You need it for your life
to make your life whole.
Children are
a wonderful part of that.
Children are
a wonderful part of that.
And the grandchildren
only add to that.
And the grandchildren
only add to that.
My dad, he passed away
about ten years ago.
My dad, he passed away
about ten years ago.
He brought us up.
He... He was a good man.
He... He was a good man.
He did the best...
He did the best he could.
He did the best...
He did the best he could.
As far as I'm concerned,
he did a good job.
As far as I'm concerned,
he did a good job.
I'm the only... child in the
village, except for my baby brother.
I'm the only... child in the
village, except for my baby brother.
I'm the only... child in the
village, except for my baby brother.
I'm the only... child in the
village, except for my baby brother.
'At seven, Nick, a farmer's son,
'At seven, Nick, a farmer's son,
'was at a one-room village school
in the Yorkshire Dales.'
'was at a one-room village school
in the Yorkshire Dales.'
I've been to Leeds
a couple of times.
I've been to Leeds
a couple of times.
I haven't been to Manchester.
I haven't been to Manchester.
Do you want to take up farming?
No.
Do you want to take up farming?
No.
I'm not interested in it.
I mean, I'm not... And I said I was
interested in physics and chemistry.
I mean, I'm not... And I said I was
interested in physics and chemistry.
Well, I'm not gonna do that here.
When I grow up, I'd like to find out
all about the moon and all that.
When I grow up, I'd like to find out
all about the moon and all that.
When I grow up, I'd like to find out
all about the moon and all that.
Get a nice picture.
'At 21,
he was reading Physics at Oxford.'
'At 21,
he was reading Physics at Oxford.'
Be nice to get this thing to work.
So, what career
are you gonna pursue?
So, what career
are you gonna pursue?
It depends
whether I'll be good enough
It depends
whether I'll be good enough
to do what I want to really do.
The gas in these experiments
is at a temperature
The gas in these experiments
is at a temperature
comparable with that of the sun,
whereas in a power reactor,
comparable with that of the sun,
whereas in a power reactor,
it would be maybe ten times
the temperature of the sun.
it would be maybe ten times
the temperature of the sun.
'At 28, he had moved to America
'At 28, he had moved to America
'and was doing nuclear research
at the University of Wisconsin.'
'and was doing nuclear research
at the University of Wisconsin.'
Reaction gives off energy
and produces the power
Reaction gives off energy
and produces the power
that would be turned
into electrical energy.
that would be turned
into electrical energy.
When I was 13, I got hold of a book
When I was 13, I got hold of a book
which said that we were really
in trouble cos of pollution.
which said that we were really
in trouble cos of pollution.
And because of this, I went
into this nuclear fusion thing.
And because of this, I went
into this nuclear fusion thing.
And because of this, I went
into this nuclear fusion thing.
I was on a mission, you know,
I was to get extremely cheap,
clean, plentiful electricity.
I was to get extremely cheap,
clean, plentiful electricity.
I was to get extremely cheap,
clean, plentiful electricity.
So, nuclear fusion looked
like it was gonna do that.
So, nuclear fusion looked
like it was gonna do that.
But even then,
they were saying it's 20 years away.
But even then,
they were saying it's 20 years away.
'Over the years,
Nick's research hit trouble,
'Over the years,
Nick's research hit trouble,
'and by 49, he's had to abandon it.'
'and by 49, he's had to abandon it.'
Was there a moment
when you realised that
all you'd been doing
wasn't gonna work out?
All you'd been doing
wasn't gonna work out?
I think it was... more gradual.
I think it was... more gradual.
I didn't want to admit it
for quite a while.
I didn't want to admit it
for quite a while.
I mean, I really believed in it.
It was a huge let-down.
I mean, I really believed in it.
It was a huge let-down.
I mean, I really believed in it.
It was a huge let-down.
Do you have a girlfriend?
I don't want to answer that.
I don't want to answer that.
I don't answer
those kind of questions.
I don't answer
those kind of questions.
I don't answer
those kind of questions.
The best answer would be to say that
I don't answer questions like that.
The best answer would be to say that
I don't answer questions like that.
But, I mean, you know,
it was what I said when I was seven,
But, I mean, you know,
it was what I said when I was seven,
and it's still the most sensible.
But, I mean, what about them?
Nick was only 17
when I first met him,
Nick was only 17
when I first met him,
and I knew he was a nice person.
and I knew he was a nice person.
I find him very attractive.
I find him very attractive.
And... he uses his intelligence
in his relationship with me,
And... he uses his intelligence
in his relationship with me,
And... he uses his intelligence
in his relationship with me,
which is very important.
A lot of people can be very bright.
A lot of people can be very bright.
'Nick and Jackie met
when they were students at Oxford.'
'Nick and Jackie met
when they were students at Oxford.'
What about you, Nick?
Why did you marry Jackie?
What about you, Nick?
Why did you marry Jackie?
Because she's...
I find her attractive.
Because she's...
I find her attractive.
She's bright and independent, and...
She's bright and independent, and...
I mean, if you'd been somebody
who... had had fixed ideas
I mean, if you'd been somebody
who... had had fixed ideas
I mean, if you'd been somebody
who... had had fixed ideas
of a woman's role in marriage
that meant... dinner on the table
at six every evening...
that meant... dinner on the table
at six every evening...
Ah, didn't I tell you about that?
The moment of pure,
unadulterated joy in my life
The moment of pure,
unadulterated joy in my life
was when my son was handed to me
when he was born.
was when my son was handed to me
when he was born.
I have never felt so optimistic,
I have never felt so optimistic,
so just purely... unworried
about anything as that,
so just purely... unworried
about anything as that,
so just purely... unworried
about anything as that,
that... It was just the strange...
It was just... Phew!
that... It was just the strange...
It was just... Phew!
So that's...
Did that last forever?
Did that last forever?
Well, no,
I mean, no, no, no, it didn't.
Well, no,
I mean, no, no, no, it didn't.
Well, no,
I mean, no, no, no, it didn't.
'By 42, they were divorced.'
'By 42, they were divorced.'
Well, it was incredibly hard.
Well, it was incredibly hard.
Erm...
What I concluded,
it was like a death.
What I concluded,
it was like a death.
So... what about yourself?
What about the future for you?
So... what about yourself?
What about the future for you?
So... what about yourself?
What about the future for you?
Well, I mean...
as you can see, I have lost...
Well, I mean...
as you can see, I have lost...
Well, I mean...
as you can see, I have lost...
I lost 60lb in the last year,
I lost 60lb in the last year,
I have... I am seriously ill.
I have... I am seriously ill.
I have a cancer in my throat.
I have a cancer in my throat.
And I don't know what the prognosis,
you know,
I don't know what's going to happen.
you know,
I don't know what's going to happen.
So I'm not really focussed
on the long-term future.
So I'm not really focussed
on the long-term future.
So I'm not really focussed
on the long-term future.
I'm focussed on fairly short-term
futures at the moment.
I'm focussed on fairly short-term
futures at the moment.
I'm focussed on fairly short-term
futures at the moment.
I'm just keeping going
and not asking too many questions
I'm just keeping going
and not asking too many questions
about... the long term.
about... the long term.
BALLOONS POPPING,
CHILDREN SQUEALING
BALLOONS POPPING,
CHILDREN SQUEALING
'And what about the other children?
Where are they now?'
'And what about the other children?
Where are they now?'
'And what about the other children?
Where are they now?'
What do you want out of life?
What do you want out of life?
The satisfaction of knowing that
The satisfaction of knowing that
The satisfaction of knowing that
I've left some sort of imprint,
I've left some sort of imprint,
rather than just lived out my life.
rather than just lived out my life.
I am still quite lonely at times,
I am still quite lonely at times,
but this is
a common characteristic of our age.
but this is
a common characteristic of our age.
I was really angry.
You wouldn't have asked
some of the other people
You wouldn't have asked
some of the other people
in this programme that question.
in this programme that question.
You would never have gone
near them with it.
You would never have gone
near them with it.
But you asked me, and you asked Sue,
and you asked Lynn.
But you asked me, and you asked Sue,
and you asked Lynn.
So you tell me why you asked us and
you wouldn't have asked the others?
So you tell me why you asked us and
you wouldn't have asked the others?
So you tell me why you asked us and
you wouldn't have asked the others?
SINGING
SINGING
There is an issue
over TV and what it does to people.
There is an issue
over TV and what it does to people.
There is an issue
over TV and what it does to people.
That was my concern with Michael
and why I didn't engage,
That was my concern with Michael
and why I didn't engage,
certainly after 28,
cos I felt he had cast everyone.
certainly after 28,
cos I felt he had cast everyone.
certainly after 28,
cos I felt he had cast everyone.
Every time I talk about Michael,
I get quite emotional.
Every time I talk about Michael,
I get quite emotional.
He was like a... diamond...
He was like a... diamond...
at the jewellers
that you hold in your hand
at the jewellers
that you hold in your hand
with this documentary and say,
"That was the man that did it."
with this documentary and say,
"That was the man that did it."
with this documentary and say,
"That was the man that did it."
They discovered that I got these
veins here that shouldn't be there.
They discovered that I got these
veins here that shouldn't be there.
They discovered that I got these
veins here that shouldn't be there.
In your brain?
Mm-hm.
I had no idea
that I was going to be this ill,
I had no idea
that I was going to be this ill,
and I had no idea
I was gonna keep living.
and I had no idea
I was gonna keep living.
But, yes, I think it's a surprise
to my doctors that I'm still around.
But, yes, I think it's a surprise
to my doctors that I'm still around.
But, yes, I think it's a surprise
to my doctors that I'm still around.
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01x01 - Episode 1
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Follows participants as pensioners and retirees as they reflect on their triumphs, trials and tribulations, and what happened to their hopes and dreams.
Follows participants as pensioners and retirees as they reflect on their triumphs, trials and tribulations, and what happened to their hopes and dreams.